:-) mostly -- McWhorter on "standard English"

[Herb Stahlke]

While I agree that a general audience would have trouble with some of
our jargon, we have these terms and make these distinctions for good
reasons.  The public will understand better what we do if we use some
of these terms and explain them than if we try to talk around them.  I
haven't studied chemistry since high school, but I appreciate it that
chemists talk about valence rather than about "ways that atoms fit
together."  I like it that other specialists don't dumb things down
for me more than necessary.

Herb

On Sat, Jan 16, 2010 at 10:36 AM, Jonathan Lighter
<wuxxmupp2000 at gmail.com> wrote:
> ---------------------- Information from the mail header -----------------------
> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>
> Subject:      Re: :-) mostly -- McWhorter on "standard English"
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> For the average NPR listener, still anxious about split infinitives, I think
> even "register" is opaque. It always makes me think of cash registers,
> relevance zilch.
>
> How about "context," "purpose," "setting," or the like. These can be
> elaborated quickly and easily.
>
> JL
> On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 10:41 PM, Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at yale.edu>wrote:
>
>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
>> -----------------------
>> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>> Poster:       Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at YALE.EDU>
>> Subject:      Re: :-) mostly -- McWhorter on "standard English"
>>
>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> At 9:01 PM -0500 1/15/10, Robin Hamilton wrote:
>> >>Register?  Not nearly as clear as "dialect" =20
>> >>
>> >>Tom Zurinskas=2C USA - CT20=2C TN3=2C NJ33=2C FL7+=20
>> >>see truespel.com phonetic spelling
>> >
>> >Perhaps not so clear, but more appropriate in this context.
>>
>> Oops, sorry Robin.  I should have scrolled down in my mailer to see
>> that you pre-empted my response.
>>
>> LH
>>
>> >"In linguistics, a register is a variety of a language used for a
>> particular
>> >purpose or in a particular social setting. For example, an English speaker
>> >may adhere more closely to prescribed grammar, pronounce words ending
>> >in -ing with a velar nasal instead of an alveolar nasal (e.g. "walking",
>> not
>> >"walkin'"), choose more formal words (e.g. train vs. choo-choo, sodium
>> >chloride vs. salt, child vs. kid, etc.), and refrain from using the word
>> >ain't when speaking in a formal setting, but the same person could violate
>> >all of these prescriptions in an informal setting."
>> >[WIKI]
>> >
>> >Whereas dialect:
>> >
>> >"The term dialect (from the Greek word _dialektos_) is used in two
>> >distinct ways, even by scholars of language. One usage refers to a variety
>> >of a language that is characteristic of a particular group of the
>> language's
>> >speakers. The term is applied most often to regional speech patterns, but
>> a
>> >dialect may also be defined by other factors, such as social class. <...>
>> >The other usage refers to a language socially subordinate to a regional or
>> >national standard language, often historically cognate to the standard,
>> but
>> >not a variety of it or in any other sense derived from it."
>> >[WIKI]
>> >
>> >They are quite distinct terms, at least in my idiolect.
>> >
>> >Robin Hamilton
>> >
>> >>>Sender: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>> >>>Poster: Robin Hamilton <robin.hamilton2 at BTINTERNET.COM>
>> >>>Subject: Re: :-) mostly -- McWhorter on "standard English"
>> >>
>> >>>  > Well=2C maybe we need to start putting "dialect" in after "Standard
>> >>>>  English". I think I might start putting "Standard American Written
>> >>>>  English dialect" in my composition syllabus to emphasize its
>> >>>>  linguistic parity with Appalachian dialects=2C Southern dialects=2C
>> >>>>  etc=
>> >>.
>> >>>  >
>> >>>>  ---Amy West
>> >>>=20
>> >>>I'd concur with this=2C Amy=2C but reword as "Standard American Written
>> >>>E=
>> >>nglish
>> >>>Register."
>> >>>=20
>> >>>The wording of the syllabus description would=2C of course=2C be
>> >>>self-referential=2C being written in SAWER.
>> >>>=20
>> >>>Robin Hamilton
>> >>>=20
>> >
>> >------------------------------------------------------------
>>  >The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>>
>
>
>
> --
> "If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the truth."
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>

------------------------------------------------------------
The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org