further adventures of "ironic"

Tue Jun 8 18:35:28 UTC 2010

In 1996 the song "Ironic" by Alanis Morissette was a number-one hit on
the Billboard Modern Rock Tracks (according to Wikipedia). The tune
received extensive airplay and the video was played in heavy rotation.
Many listeners were directly or indirectly exposed to the Morissette
inspired definition of the word ironic. Here are some of the lyrics
(according to AZlyrics):

    Ironic by Alanis Morissette

An old man turned ninety-eight
He won the lottery and died the next day
It's a black fly in your Chardonnay
It's a death row pardon two minutes too late
And isn't it ironic... don't you think

It's like rain on your wedding day
It's a free ride when you've already paid
It's the good advice that you just didn't take
Who would've thought... it figures
...
A traffic jam when you're already late
A no-smoking sign on your cigarette break
It's like ten thousand spoons when all you need is a knife
It's meeting the man of my dreams
And then meeting his beautiful wife
And isn't it ironic...don't you think
A little too ironic...and, yeah, I really do think...

http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/alanismorissette/ironic.html

I suspect that the speaker of the words "It was a tiny parade, and
they shut down Graham Avenue?  There was one float and a horrible
marching band.  It was very ironic" was influenced by the Morissettian
definition. The street was closed down with the expectation that a
grand parade would occur. Instead, a pathetically inconsequentially
event took place. This fits the pattern of the Morissettian concept of
irony I think.

On Tue, Jun 8, 2010 at 10:34 AM, RonButters <ronbutters at aol.com> wrote:
> ---------------------- Information from the mail header -----------------------
> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       RonButters <ronbutters at AOL.COM>
> Subject:      Re: further adventures of "ironic"
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> One sense of IRONY is 'a situation in which things do not turn out as one of the participants would expect' (dramatic irony). I suppose the player did not expect that all of his homers would have been hit against the Tigers. The Tigers were probably even more surprised.
> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: George Thompson <george.thompson at NYU.EDU>
> Date:         Mon, 7 Jun 2010 17:13:38
> To: <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Subject:      Re: [ADS-L] further adventures of "ironic"
>
> It seems to me that "the standard meaning of *ironic*" these days, (unless you are in the company of English majors, which god forbid) is "marked by a slightly amusing trivial coincidence".  I hear on sports broadcasts "He's hit only 3 homeruns this season, and, ironically, they have all been against the Tigers."  The drift from that to whatever Tocco may have had in mind seems to me to be inevitable.
>
> GAT
>
> George A. Thompson
> Author of A Documentary History of "The African Theatre", Northwestern Univ. Pr., 1998, but nothing much lately.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Rick Barr <rickbarremail at gmail.com>
> Date: Monday, June 7, 2010 3:19 pm
> Subject: Re: further adventures of "ironic"
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
>
>> It's an odd phrase, to say that closing down the street for the languid
>> parade was very ironic. I agree with George that "strange" is probably
>> what
>> the speaker had in mind. But it's a special kind of strange, nuanced
>> by the
>> standard meaning of *ironic*, involving a disparity between two things
>> (the
>> real and the one that is presented, the intended meaning and the stated
>> one). I think that's what the speaker was aiming for, that it was
>> strange to
>> see such a disparity between the size of the parade and the magnitude
>> of the
>> chaos produced by it. I haven't seen other examples of this sort of
>> "ironic." Might the fact that the man was feeling IRate have prompted
>> the
>> choice of IRonic?
>>
>> -- Rick
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jun 7, 2010 at 11:05 AM, George Thompson <george.thompson at nyu.edu>wrote:
>>
>> > ---------------------- Information from the mail header
>> > -----------------------
>> > Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>> > Poster:       George Thompson <george.thompson at NYU.EDU>
>> > Subject:      further adventures of "ironic"
>> >
>> > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >
>> > An article in today's NYTimes on street processions in the Williamsburgh
>> > area, honoring patron saints, specifically St. Cono, of Teggiano, Italy.
>> >  (section A, p. 16, column 1, for those of us still bound to print-on-paper)
>> >  This area of Williamsburgh was until recently largely inhabited by
>> Italian
>> > Catholics, but it seems now has a considerable number of young
>> residents not
>> > raised to the tradition.
>> > One (Chris Tocco, 26, an actor) is quoted as saying: "It was a tiny
>> parade,
>> > and they shut down Graham Avenue?  There was one float and a horrible
>> > marching band.  It was very ironic."
>> > If Mr. Toco were to be asked to pick a replacement for the word "ironic"
>> > here, he might choose "having the the nature of irony or covert sarcasm;
>> > meaning the opposite of what is expressed"; he might choose "showing
>> a
>> > condition of affairs or events of a character opposite to what was,
>> or might
>> > naturally be, expected"; he might even choose "being marked by a slightly
>> > amusing trivial coincidence"; but I think he would choose "strange".
>> >
>> > A 27 year old onlooker offered the insight "It's kind of like a
>> vestige of
>> > the old neighborhoods of Brooklyn".  It is like that, indeed, kind of.
>> >
>> > (First two defs. adapted from the OED)
>> >
>> > GAT
>> >
>> > George A. Thompson
>> > Author of A Documentary History of "The African Theatre", Northwestern
>> > Univ. Pr., 1998, but nothing much lately.
>> >
>> > ------------------------------------------------------------
>> > The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>> >
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>

------------------------------------------------------------
The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org