Query: "I've got your number."

[victor steinbok]

There can be no question that George Thompson is correct in his
observation--a number of sources from 1841 forward confirm this use of
"I've got your/his number", and I found references in a variety of US
and UK sources, including Alcott's novels. The problem is, the same
expression was used in a number of other contexts.

1) Cabs/Cab drivers (hansoms)--both US and UK
2) Policemen--UK
3) Bus (Omnibus) drivers--London
4) Regiment and other subdivision numbers--UK (from Wellington's
dispatches to commanders at Waterloo)--when someone relinquished a
command and was later commissioned again to the same rank, they often
wanted their old regiments/divisions/etc. back, but someone else might
have "got his number".
5) Very common references in British Commissions (Royal/Parliamentary)
who, while questioning witnesses, would respond to submitted records
(usually in advance, with copies held by witnesses) with "I've got
your number." I am not quite sure why it's "number" and not "numbers",
but that's what's on record. Of course, I did not search for "numbers"
so such references may be even more numerous. The bottom line is that
it was the same turn of phrase and used during the same period.

The earliest reference, by far, is (4), Wellington's dispatches in
1815. This is followed by (1) and (3), from the 1840s forward, (2) and
(5) from 1870s forward. (I only checked as far as 1890.)

There are a few other, apparently isolated references, such as hotel
room number that could be observed when the keys are handed over to
the porter or clerk (still common practice in Europe, but not US),
and, of course, generic use from 1840s forward.

I have most of the references covered, but don't have time to deal
with it now. I am not sure how helpful all of this is, as it seems to
muddy the scene more than resolving it. But one can't go wrong with
(1), even if it's an indication of a particular SES subclass. And full
credit to George.

VS-)

On Tue, Mar 16, 2010 at 9:31 PM, George Thompson
<george.thompson at nyu.edu> wrote:
>
> By the 1820s, at least, in NYC, hacks were required to carry a clearly readable number, one that would be lit up at night, to help identify the hack, whether in traffic cases -- hit & run, &c. -- or in complaints by riders.  No doubt there was a similar policy in London -- a much larger city.
> An irate passenger/driver could threaten "I've got your number, you won't get away with this."
>
> GAT
>
> George A. Thompson
> Author of A Documentary History of "The African Theatre", Northwestern Univ. Pr., 1998, but nothing much lately.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: victor steinbok <aardvark66 at gmail.com>
> Date: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 8:05 pm
> Subject: Re: Query: "I've got your number."
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
>
>> Clearly not telephone. Consider this line from a 1844 Punch poem.
>>
>> http://books.google.com/books?id=40wPAQAAIAAJ
>> Punch, Vol. 7, 1844, p. 261
>>
>> The Buss-Driver's Lament Over Bygone Days.
>>
>> ...
>> When we,--that is, myself and cad,--
>> Could o'er our pewters slumber ;
>> But, stop an instant now, 'gad !
>> The p'liceman 's got your number.
>>
>>
>> But all this show is that the expression was in use in 1844 London,
>> not where it came from.
>>
>> I do have a couple of guesses, but I'll post them later. I hope this
>> is not a rush question.
>>
>> VS-)
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Mar 16, 2010 at 7:28 PM, Laurence Horn
>> <laurence.horn at yale.edu> wrote:
>> >
>> > At 6:14 PM -0500 3/16/10, Gerald Cohen wrote:
>> >>  A colleague has asked me about the origin of the slang phrase
>> "I've got
>> >>your number" (= to have precise, useful knowledge of someone's weaknesses;
>> >>have someone in a critical position).
>> >>
>> >>I checked Jonathan Lighter's excellent HDAS and see examples going
>> back to
>> >>1853, but I don't see an etymology given, so I suppose this silence
>> equates
>> >>to "Origin unknown."
>> >>
>> >>I see various items on the expression in Google but am not clear
>> about their
>> >>reliability.  Would anyone know what the "number" originally
>> referred to?
>> >>
>> >>Gerald Cohen
>> >>
>> >
>> > I always assumed, without any privileged knowledge, that it referred
>> > to a phone number:  I've got your number, I know where to reach/get
>> > to you, you can't escape...   Maybe evoking those old movies like
>> > "Dial M for Murder", in which the bad guy has the good guy/gal's
>> > (phone) number and can call it at will to raise the latter's fear
>> > quotient and the audience's tension.  But that's just a guess.
>> >
>> > LH
>>
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>
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