ont/ahnt

[Jocelyn Limpert]

My "dog" never rhymed -- nor did he write -- just barked in some
unidentifiable "doggy dialect"!  His heritage was mixed and place of origin
questionable. But everyone understood him!

On Thu, Oct 7, 2010 at 5:11 AM, Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at gmail.com>wrote:

> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> -----------------------
> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>
> Subject:      Re: ont/ahnt
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Hog rhymes with frog and log.  It has [ a:] as in gaga.
>
> Dog doesn't rhyme with anything I can think of offhand. It has [D: ] as in
> "chalk").
>
> JL
>
> On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 7:14 PM, Paul Johnston <paul.johnston at wmich.edu
> >wrote:
>
> > ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> > -----------------------
> > Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> > Poster:       Paul Johnston <paul.johnston at WMICH.EDU>
> > Subject:      Re: ont/ahnt
> >
> >
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Dear Jonathan,
> > That's my pattern too.  My wife makes fun of my pronunciation of both dog
> > and hog, (She has [D]).
> >
> > Paul Johnston
> >  On Oct 6, 2010, at 7:10 PM, Jonathan Lighter wrote:
> >
> > > ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> > -----------------------
> > > Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> > > Poster:       Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>
> > > Subject:      Re: ont/ahnt
> > >
> >
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Father and bother rhyme perfectly for me.
> > >
> > > Dog and hog don't. At all.
> > >
> > > JL
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 6:37 PM, Paul Johnston <paul.johnston at wmich.edu
> > >wrote:
> > >
> > >> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> > >> -----------------------
> > >> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> > >> Poster:       Paul Johnston <paul.johnston at WMICH.EDU>
> > >> Subject:      Re: ont/ahnt
> > >>
> > >>
> >
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >>
> > >> "CON"/"KAHN" would work as [kDn]/[kAn] in the Pittsburgh area, I
> think,
> > and
> > >> neither would rhyme with "town", which would be [tan].  I just checked
> > with
> > >> two colleagues of mine, one from Canonsburg, PA, the other from
> > Fairmont,
> > >> WV, and they had different vowels in father and bother (a near-minimal
> > pair)
> > >> as [A] vs. [D] (rounded low vowel).  The latter is LOT/THOUGHT for
> them.
> > >> The former is, in Wells's terminology, PALM.
> > >>
> > >> Paul Johnston
> > >> On Oct 6, 2010, at 6:17 PM, David Wake wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> > >> -----------------------
> > >>> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> > >>> Poster:       David Wake <dwake at STANFORDALUMNI.ORG>
> > >>> Subject:      Re: ont/ahnt
> > >>>
> > >>
> >
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >>>
> > >>> Can you offer a minimal pairs for these dialects?  E.g. "con"/"Kahn",
> > >>> perhaps?  I thought that, with the exception of Eastern New England,
> > >>> these dialects would all use their LOT vowel (rounded or unrounded)
> > >>> for both lexical sets.
> > >>>
> > >>> D
> > >>>
> > >>> On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 11:16 AM, Paul Johnston <
> > paul.johnston at wmich.edu>
> > >> wrote:
> > >>>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> > >> -----------------------
> > >>>> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> > >>>> Poster:       Paul Johnston <paul.johnston at WMICH.EDU>
> > >>>> Subject:      Re: ont/ahnt
> > >>>>
> > >>
> >
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Most dialects where the LOT class is a low back ROUNDED vowel will
> > >> pronounce ont and ahnt differently, particularly because of the /n/
> > after
> > >> it-- Eastern New England, the area from Erie PA through Pittsburgh
> down
> > into
> > >> West Virginia and into Kentucky, several Upper Southern dialects,
> > Canada--in
> > >> Eastern New England, the difference should be really striking: [D] (I
> > mean
> > >> the IPA symbol for a low back rounded vowel here) vs. a front [a:].
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Paul Johnston
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> On Oct 6, 2010, at 10:23 AM, Joel S. Berson wrote:
> > >>>>
> > >>>>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> > >> -----------------------
> > >>>>> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> > >>>>> Poster:       "Joel S. Berson" <Berson at ATT.NET>
> > >>>>> Subject:      Re: ont/ahnt
> > >>>>>
> > >>
> >
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> At 10/5/2010 08:49 PM, Wilson Gray wrote:
> > >>>>>> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 5:45 PM, David Wake <
> > dwake at stanfordalumni.org>
> > >> wrote:
> > >>>>>>> "ont"
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> In most dialects of AmE, "ont" = "ahnt."
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> Can you give me some examples where it doesn't?  And please don't
> say
> > >>>>> you won't.
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> Joel
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------
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> > >>>>
> > >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------
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> > >>>>
> > >>>
> > >>> ------------------------------------------------------------
> > >>> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
> > >>
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> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > "If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the
> > truth."
> > >
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> >
>
>
>
> --
> "If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the truth."
>
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