Quote: he only lamented, that he had but one life to lose for his country (Nathan Hale 1799)
Dan Goncharoff
thegonch at GMAIL.COM
Sun Apr 22 16:00:27 UTC 2012
No argument here. It just doesn't explain to my satisfaction why a
quote from a guy who died in 1776 is dated 1799. Neoclassicism and
Romanticism still used the calendar correctly.
Sent from my iPhone
On Apr 22, 2012, at 10:13 AM, Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM> wrote:
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> Sender: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster: Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>
> Subject: Re: Quote: he only lamented, that he had but one life to lose for
> his country (Nathan Hale 1799)
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> To elucidate: Neoclassical "Literary types" weren't hoaxers and liars;
> they just believed that the idea was more important than exact words, and
> that important ideas should be expressed and preserved in their most nearly
> perfect form. The Romantics probably felt the same way.
>
> Or am I dreaming that?
>
> JL
>
> On Sun, Apr 22, 2012 at 9:58 AM, Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
>> -----------------------
>> Sender: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>> Poster: Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>
>> Subject: Re: Quote: he only lamented, that he had but one life to
>> lose for
>> his country (Nathan Hale 1799)
>>
>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> It has to be dated 1799 because nobody knows for sure what Hale said.
>>
>> The prior exx. as well as the contemporaneous reports seem to confirm that
>> Hale probably did say something like "I wish only that I had more lives to
>> give." I do not believe that witnesses would have tried very hard to
>> report his exact words unless they were truly stunning. Literary types of
>> the period, moreover, would not have hesitated to modify any words
>> attributed to Hale until they attained a seemingly ideal level of drama and
>> expression.
>>
>> That just what the age was like. They weren't us
>>
>> BTW, I can recall a fellow undergraduate about 1971 explaining that either
>> Hale's words were a pure propaganda invention by the System, or else Hale
>> was an asshole. See previous paragraph.
>>
>>
>>
>> JL
>>
>> On Sat, Apr 21, 2012 at 5:49 PM, Dan Goncharoff <thegonch at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
>>> -----------------------
>>> Sender: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>>> Poster: Dan Goncharoff <thegonch at GMAIL.COM>
>>> Subject: Re: Quote: he only lamented, that he had but one life to
>>> lose for
>>> his country (Nathan Hale 1799)
>>>
>>>
>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> OK, I am lost here.
>>>
>>> First, how could any Nathan Hale quote be dated 1799 when Nathan Hale
>> died
>>> in 1776??
>>>
>>> I am, however, as a Yale man, relieved by the identification of a
>>> contemporaneous quote.
>>>
>>> DanG
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Apr 21, 2012 at 12:44 AM, Garson O'Toole
>>> <adsgarsonotoole at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
>>>> -----------------------
>>>> Sender: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>>>> Poster: Garson O'Toole <adsgarsonotoole at GMAIL.COM>
>>>> Subject: Re: Quote: he only lamented, that he had but one life to
>>>> lose for
>>>> his country (Nathan Hale 1799)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> Many thanks to Larry for sending the photo of the Nathan Hale statue
>>>> outside Connecticut Hall.
>>>>
>>>> Here are two citations within GenealogyBank for interesting early
>>>> variants in 1777 and 1781 of the famous "last words" credited to
>>>> Nathan Hale. In addition, here are two precursors (of many) in 1680
>>>> for the 1777 saying.
>>>>
>>>> Cite: 1777 March 25, Pennsylvania Evening Post, "Newbury Port,
>>>> February 13", Page 166, [Front page of the March 25, 1777 issue is
>>>> numbered 163], Pennsylvania. (GenealogyBank)
>>>>
>>>> [Begin excerpt]
>>>> However, at the gallows, he made a sensible and spirited speech; among
>>>> other things, told them they were shedding the blood of the innocent,
>>>> and that if he had ten thousand lives, he would lay them all down, if
>>>> called to it, in defence of his injured bleeding country.
>>>> [End excerpt]
>>>>
>>>> The above variant was mentioned in "Documentary Life of Nathan Hale"
>>>> (1941) by George Dudley Seymour. The citation given by Seymour was for
>>>> "Essex Journal" (Massachusetts) on February 13, 1777.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> http://books.google.com/books?id=PxkkjSRgMiAC&q=%22lay+them%22#v=snippet&
>>>>
>>>> GenealogyBank contains issues of The Essex Journal (Newburyport,
>>>> Massachusetts) in 1777, but the February 13, 1777 issue is missing. So
>>>> I have only seen digital images of the March 25, 1777 reprint given
>>>> above. The following cite is also mentioned by Seymour.
>>>>
>>>> Cite: 1781 May 17, Independent Chronicle and the Universal Advertiser
>>>> [New-England Chronicle], "For the Boston Chronicle", Page 1, Column 1,
>>>> Boston, Massachusetts. (GenealogyBank)
>>>>
>>>> [Begin excerpt]
>>>> ... but just before he expired said, aloud, "I am so satisfied with
>>>> the cause in which I have engaged, that my only regret is, that I have
>>>> not more lives than one to offer in its service."
>>>> [End excerpt]
>>>>
>>>> Here is a precursor published in 1680 (referring to a speech in 1649)
>>>> in which the speaker is willing to lay down a thousand lives.
>>>>
>>>> Cite: 1680, England's black Tribunal: Set forth in the Tryal of King
>>>> Charles I, Third Edition, [The Speech of Col. John Morris lately
>>>> Governour of Pomfret Castle, at the place of his Execution at York,
>>>> August 23 1649], Start Page 104, Quote Page 105, Printed for Playford,
>>>> London. (Google Books full view)
>>>>
>>>
>> http://books.google.com/books?id=nfo9AAAAcAAJ&q=%22lay+them%22#v=snippet&
>>>>
>>>> [Begin excerpt]
>>>> I bless God I am thought worthy to suffer for his Name, and for so
>>>> good a cause; and if I had a thousand lives, I would willingly lay
>>>> them down for the cause of my King, the Lords Anointed ...
>>>> [End excerpt]
>>>>
>>>> Here is a precursor from the same 1680 volume in which the speaker is
>>>> willing to lay down 10 million lives.
>>>>
>>>> Cite: 1680, England's black Tribunal: Set forth in the Tryal of King
>>>> Charles I, Third Edition, [The Speech and manner of putting to death
>>>> Col. John Gerhard, who was beheaded on Tower Hill, July 10 1654;
>>>> Published by his Friends], Start Page 142, Quote Page 145, Printed for
>>>> Playford, London. (Google Books full view)
>>>>
>>>
>> http://books.google.com/books?id=nfo9AAAAcAAJ&q=%22lay+them%22#v=snippet&
>>>>
>>>> [Begin excerpt]
>>>> But this I desire all to take notice of, and this he spoke (with a
>>>> double vehemence) that I die a faithful subject and servant to King
>>>> Charles the second, whom I pray God to bless and restore to his
>>>> Rights; and had I ten thousand thousand lives I would glady lay them
>>>> all down thus for his service.
>>>> [End excerpt]
>>>>
>>>> NewspaperArchive has an interesting precursor with a date of October
>>>> 4, 1642 in the Scottish Mercury, London, Middlesex. But none of the
>>>> page images show the date and there is no first page. It is wonky.
>>>>
>>>> Garson
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Apr 20, 2012 at 2:06 PM, Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at yale.edu
>>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
>>>> -----------------------
>>>>> Sender: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>>>>> Poster: Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at YALE.EDU>
>>>>> Subject: Re: Quote: he only lamented, that he had but one life
>> to
>>>> lose for
>>>>> his country (Nathan Hale 1799)
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> FWIW--probably little--the official statue of Nathan Hale, a gift of
>>> the
>>>> class of 1913 that stands outside Connecticut Hall on the campus of
>> Yale
>>>> University ("In this hall was the room of Nathan Hale, of the Class of
>>>> 1773"), the legend on the base reads as follows:
>>>>>
>>>>> I ONLY REGRET THAT I HAVE BUT ONE LIVE TO LOSE FOR MY COUNTRY
>>>>>
>>>>> LH
>>>>>
>>>>> (I have a photograph of the statue, with Connecticut Hall in the
>>>> background, that I can send to anyone interested, although only a part
>> of
>>>> the legend is visible.)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Apr 20, 2012, at 4:26 AM, Garson O'Toole wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Barry Popik already had an entry on this topic which I should have
>>>>>> found and linked to in my previous post. Sorry.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://goo.gl/Mfl0L
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> http://www.barrypopik.com/index.php/new_york_city/entry/i_only_regret_that_i_have_but_one_life_to_lose_for_my_country_nathan_hale/
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The precursors and partial matches I located were not included in
>> the
>>>>>> previous post which was focused on Nathan Hale. So here now are some
>>>>>> of those earlier cites which may be of interest in chronological
>>>>>> order.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In this 1660 cite the word "griev'd" was used instead of "lamented"
>> or
>>>>>> "regretted". Also, the motivating force was religion and not
>>>>>> nationalism.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cite: 1660, Three Decads of Sermons, Lately Preached to the
>> University
>>>>>> at St Mary's Church in Oxford by Henry Wilkinson, "Joy in the Lord,
>> as
>>>>>> a Strong Ground of Comfort Against All Discomforts", Start Page 157,
>>>>>> Quote Page 174, Printed by H. H. for Thomas Robinson. (Google Books
>>>>>> full view)\
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> http://books.google.com/books?id=AXcGpZLJn5sC&q=%22one+life%22#v=snippet&
>>>>>> [Begin excerpt]
>>>>>> John Ardley a blessed Martyr griev'd that he had but one life to lay
>>>>>> downe for Christ, if I had (saith he) as many lifes as there are
>>>>>> heyres of my head, they should all goe for Christ.
>>>>>> [End excerpt]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Vexations in love seem to be the motive behind the following grand
>>>>>> pronouncement.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cite: 1708, The Ingenious and Diverting Letters of the Lady's -
>>>>>> Travels into Spain by [Marie-Catherine Le Jumel de Barneville d'
>>>>>> Aulnoy], [The Seventh Edition], Page 80, Printed for Samuel Crouch,
>>>>>> London. (Google Books full view)
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> http://books.google.com/books?id=H-g_AAAAcAAJ&q=%22expiate+all%22#v=snippet&
>>>>>> [Begin excerpt]
>>>>>> I ought to die with Sorrow for having betray'd you; and if I regret
>>>>>> any thing in dying, it is only the having one Life to lose to
>> expiate
>>>>>> all the Crimes you can justly accuse me of.
>>>>>> [End excerpt]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The following passage in a play by Joseph Addison was cited in the
>>>>>> Yale Book of Quotations, the Quote Verifier, and Barry's website.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cite: 1713, Cato: A Tragedy: As It Is Acted at the Theatre-Royal in
>>>>>> Drury-Lane By Joseph Addison, Page 53, Printed for J. Tonson,
>> London.
>>>>>> (Google Books full view)
>>>>>>
>>>>
>> http://books.google.com/books?id=RkMJAAAAQAAJ&q=%22die+but%22#v=snippet&
>>>>>> [Begin excerpt]
>>>>>> How beautiful is Death, when earn'd by Virtue!
>>>>>> Who wou'd not be that Youth? what Pity is it
>>>>>> That we can die but once to serve our Country!
>>>>>> [End excerpt]
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cite: 1719, The State-Weathercocks: or, A New Secret History by John
>>>>>> Dunton, Whig Loyalty or Mr. John Dunton's Private Letter to Queen
>>>>>> Anne, Start Page 89, Quote Page 91, Printed for the Author and are
>> to
>>>>>> be Sold by S. Poping, London. (Google Books full view)
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> http://books.google.com/books?id=VDkIAAAAQAAJ&q=%22one+Life%22#v=snippet&
>>>>>> [Begin excerpt]
>>>>>> However I have but one Life to lose, and in my suffering for
>> detecting
>>>>>> the Enemies to my Queen and Country, I think Death it self a Reward;
>>>>>> for to be Martyr'd, for a Good Cause, is to die but once, and then
>> to
>>>>>> live for ever.
>>>>>> [End excerpt]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A biographical reference published in 1760 attributed a precursor
>>>>>> statement to John Lilburne, a leader of the Levellers, who died in
>>>>>> 1657.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cite: 1760, Biographia Britannica: or, The Lives of the Most Eminent
>>>>>> Persons Who Have Flourished in Great Britain and Ireland, Volume 5,
>>>>>> Section: Lilburne, Start Page 2937, Quote Page 2955, Printed for W.
>>>>>> Meadows, J. Walthoee, etcetera, London. (Google Books full view)
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> http://books.google.com/books?id=rYhDAAAAcAAJ&q=%22one+life%22#v=snippet&
>>>>>> [Begin excerpt]
>>>>>> ... give me leave to tell you, I am sorry I have but one life to
>> lose,
>>>>>> in maintaining the truth, justice, and righteousness, of so gallant
>> a
>>>>>> piece.
>>>>>> [End excerpt]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Barry Popik and Victor Steinbok kindly told me about the following
>>>>>> citation off-list which I also had found independently
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cite: 1770, A Fair Account of the Late Unhappy Disturbance At Boston
>>>>>> in New England, [Testimony of Henry Dougan, Sworn before James
>> Murray,
>>>>>> March 14, 1770] Start Page 19, Quote Page 20, Printed for B. White,
>>>>>> London. (Google Books full view)
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> http://books.google.com/books?id=bKtbAAAAQAAJ&q=%22one+life%22#v=snippet&
>>>>>> [Begin excerpt]
>>>>>> I heard them repeatedly say, "they had but one life to lose, and
>> that
>>>>>> they were willing to lose it for their country;" and also said,
>> "that
>>>>>> Mr. Hancock said he had but one life, that he would lose it for his
>>>>>> country, and why should not they?
>>>>>> [End excerpt]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cite: 1782, A General History of Connecticut: from Its First
>>>>>> Settlement Under George Fenwick by Samuel Peters, Second Edition,
>>>>>> Appendix, Page 415, Printed for the Author; and sold by J. Bew,
>>>>>> London. (Google Books full view)
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> http://books.google.com/books?id=InsFAAAAQAAJ&q=%22one+life%22#v=snippet&
>>>>>> [Begin excerpt]
>>>>>> Peters told them he had but one life to lose, and he would lose it
>> in
>>>>>> defence of his house and property.
>>>>>> [End excerpt]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Garson
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 5:59 PM, Garson O'Toole
>>>>>> <adsgarsonotoole at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
>>>> -----------------------
>>>>>>> Sender: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>>>>>>> Poster: Garson O'Toole <adsgarsonotoole at GMAIL.COM>
>>>>>>> Subject: Quote: he only lamented, that he had but one life to
>>>> lose for his
>>>>>>> country (Nathan Hale 1799)
>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The revolutionary rebel Nathan Hale was hanged by the British as a
>>> spy
>>>>>>> in 1776. What Hale said or did not say shortly before his execution
>>> is
>>>>>>> a complex question of history. The words attributed to him became
>>>>>>> famous in the United States.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Yale Book of Quotations and the Quote Verifier have valuable
>>>>>>> entries on the quotation credited to Hale.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The earliest evidence I can find for a version of this saying is
>> in a
>>>>>>> 1799 history book by Hannah Adams. This book was, in part, compiled
>>>>>>> using other history books. So an older source is possible in the
>> gap
>>>>>>> of twenty-three years between 1776 and 1799. Maybe some list member
>>>>>>> has better access to databases with manuscripts from the 1700s.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The words attributed to Hale are between quotation marks, but the
>> use
>>>>>>> of a third person grammatical construct is odd to this modern
>> reader.
>>>>>>> Maybe some list member knows more about this style of written (or
>>>>>>> spoken) speech in the United States in 1799.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Cite: 1799, A Summary History of New-England: From the First
>>>>>>> Settlement at Plymouth to the Acceptance of the Federal
>> Constitution:
>>>>>>> Comprehending a General Sketch of the American War by Hannah Adams,
>>>>>>> Quote Page 359, Printed for the Author by H. Mann and J. H. Adams,
>>>>>>> Dedham. (HathiTrust)
>>>>>>> [Begin excerpt]
>>>>>>> "Unknown to all around him, without a single friend to offer him
>> the
>>>>>>> least consolation, thus fell as amiable and as worthy a young man
>> as
>>>>>>> America could boast, with this, as his dying observation, "that he
>>>>>>> only lamented, that he had but one life to lose for his country."
>>>>>>> [End excerpt]
>>>>>>
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>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> "If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the truth."
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> "If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the truth."
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