End the word (was: a word from "Huck Finn") faggot etc.

Sat Mar 3 17:26:56 UTC 2012

In my junior-high experience,  weakened "fag/ faggot" was used both as a
generally opprobrious insult and also with the more specific meaning of
"sissy" (cowardly fellow), a word which was hardly used at all.

"Faggot" was the somewhat stronger term.

JL

On Sat, Mar 3, 2012 at 11:56 AM, Michael Newman
<michael.newman at qc.cuny.edu>wrote:

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> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       Michael Newman <michael.newman at QC.CUNY.EDU>
> Subject:      Re: End the word (was: a word from "Huck Finn") faggot etc.
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> This reminds me of when I taught high school back in 1996-1997. The
> students all knew I was gay, and they also knew I objected to their use of
> "faggot," "fag," "queer," and "homo." With the ninth graders in particular,
> a routine developed where one would call one of his (always his) classmates
> one of these names, and then turn to me and say, "sorry Mike." (alternative
> school, so we used first names for teachers.) They didn't apologize to each
> other because none of it was serious, and I didn't make them because it
> just too funny. Any way, it got to the point that they would do it just so
> they could say, "sorry Mike."  The only time the word was used seriously in
> my memory was when a somewhat troubled kid I did not have but was
> essentially babysitting in my class so he wouldn't be running around the
> halls causing mischief, said apropos of nothing I can remember, "I hate
> faggots." I asked him if he hated me, and he confessed he thought it was a
> only a rumor. Of course, all of u!
>  s including the social worker thought he was actually really gay.
>
>
>
>
> Michael Newman
> Associate Professor of Linguistics
> Queens College/CUNY
> michael.newman at qc.cuny.edu
>
>
>
> On Mar 3, 2012, at 5:29 PM, Jonathan Lighter wrote:
>
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> > Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> > Poster:       Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>
> > Subject:      Re: End the word (was: a word from "Huck Finn")
> >
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >> Are you sure people using those two pairs were from the same planet?
> >
> > As whom?  As each other, surely. The torrent of foul language I first
> heard
> > in the 7th grade was a world apart from anything I'd ever heard before.
> > That it was a boys' school may have had something to do with it.
> >
> > But if you mean "the same planet as us today," recall that "The past is a
> > foreign country. They do things differently there."
> >
> > "Fag" and "faggot" were fairly routine insults that nobody, so far as I
> > could see, took literally, though everybody (except me at first) knew
> > the literal (i.e., originally metaphoric) meaning.  Unless said in
> obvious
> > anger, nobody bridled much at "motherfucker," either, etc., etc.  One kid
> > got furious at being called a "son of a bitch" because, like speakers of
> > decades and centuries past, insisted on interpreting it as a slur against
> > his mother. AFAICT, the bystanders thought he was nuts and simply
> spoiling
> > for a fight.
> >
> > "Bastard" was almost as common as "motherfucker," with "son of a bitch"
> > third.  There were also "turd" and "little shit."  "Stupid fucker" was
> also
> > in use. Nothing as surreal as what can be found at Urbandictionary.com.
> >
> > Note to future generations: though it was clearly occurring beyond my
> > ken in 1959 (see HDAS), I don't recall hearing  "asshole" used as an
> insult
> > until 1964.  Point: nowadays one hears it several times a day - as
> English
> > imperceptibly evolves.
> >
> > JL
> >
> >
> > On Sat, Mar 3, 2012 at 10:57 AM, Victor Steinbok <aardvark66 at gmail.com
> >wrote:
> >
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> >> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> >> Poster:       Victor Steinbok <aardvark66 at GMAIL.COM>
> >> Subject:      Re: End the word (was: a word from "Huck Finn")
> >>
> >>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >> Are you sure people using those two pairs were from the same planet?
> >> Because they certainly would not be today--they are separated by several
> >> degrees of magnitude on the insultability scale. It's like a difference
> >> between "snotnose" and "motherfucker".
> >>
> >>    VS-)
> >>
> >> On 3/3/2012 8:23 AM, Jonathan Lighter wrote:
> >>> When I was in 7th grade in NYC (1959-1960) _spaz_ (n.) and _spastic_
> >> (n.&  adj.) were the dismissive male insults of choice, with_fag_ and
> >> _faggot_ tied for fourth.
> >>>
> >>> I hadn't heard any of them before. But I hadn't heard "motherfucker"
> >> before
> >>> either, which was also up there in popularity.
> >>>
> >>> JL
> >>
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> >
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