between inclusive

[Wilson Gray]

But nobody finds "between the _age_ of…" as opposed to "between the
 _ages_ of…" hinky except me?

Youneverknow.


On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 7:28 PM, Joel S. Berson <Berson at att.net> wrote:

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> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       "Joel S. Berson" <Berson at ATT.NET>
> Subject:      Re: between inclusive
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> At 6/4/2013 04:55 PM, Laurence Horn wrote:
> >On Jun 4, 2013, at 1:37 PM, Joel S. Berson wrote:
> >
> > > At 6/4/2013 01:04 PM, Benjamin Barrett wrote:
> > >> Yes, although we might not agree on the judgments, I think it's
> > >> clear that the definition of "between" needs to be rewritten to
> > >> allow the possibility of including the endpoints. I would say that
> > >> the dollars and patients examples are both inclusive.
> > >
> > > I would say the  "patients between the age of 40 and 50" example
> > > excludes those of age 50; that is, it is intended to be a 10-year,
> > > not 11- or 9-year range.  Others may disagree with my interpretation,
> > > which is perhaps why so many patients die.
> >
> >Sounds like a threat!  ;-)
> >
> >LH
>
> Disclaimer:  I am not a licensed doctor of medicine.
>
> JSB
>
>
> > >  In any case, my "between"
> > > for this example is different from the previous definitions -- it
> > > includes one endpoint but not the other.
> > >
> > > Joel
> > >
> > >
> > >> Benjamin Barrett
> > >> Seattle, WA
> > >>
> > >> On Jun 4, 2013, at 6:58 AM, Dan Goncharoff <thegonch at GMAIL.COM>
> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> > If you asked me to pick a number between 1 and 10, I would find that
> > >> > unclear -- are 1 and 10 possible picks?
> > >> >
> > >> > If you asked me to pick a number from 1 to 10, I would know exactly
> what
> > >> > you mean.
> > >> >
> > >> > In other contexts, however, I would have to make a judgment based on
> > >> > specificity. Your "somewhere between 40 and 50 dollars" is not
> > the same as
> > >> > "patients between the age of 40 and 50".
> > >> >
> > >> > DanG
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 5:13 AM, Benjamin Barrett
> > >> <gogaku at ix.netcom.com>wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> >> The OED says about "between": Of the relation of a number,
> quantity,
> > >> >> degree, or quality to two others above and below it, or
> > differing from it
> > >> >> in opposite ways; Intermediate to.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> One of the cites is:
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Between five and six miles from the city.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> If I emphasize the words "between," "five" and "six" just
> > right, I think I
> > >> >> can make it not include five or six, but generally speaking,
> > I don't think
> > >> >> that's the case.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Wiktionary has the same issue:
> > >> >>
> > >> >> In the position or interval that separates (two things), or
> > intermediate
> > >> >> in quantity or degree.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> This works fine for the following sample sentence:
> > >> >> 1. John stood between Amy and Mary.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> but less well for 2 and very poorly for 3:
> > >> >> 2. Let's meet between two and three.
> > >> >> 3. I want to buy one that costs somewhere between forty and
> > fifty dollars.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> My concern is not merely petty pedantry: I just got called on this
> very
> > >> >> issue by my Japanese client who thought my use of "between" was
> > >> >> inappropriate as a translation of Japanese copy which is
> inclusive. I
> > >> >> explained that while the OED agrees with her, I had to nevertheless
> > >> >> disagree.
> > >> >>
> > >>
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-- 
-Wilson
-----
All say, "How hard it is that we have to die!"---a strange complaint to
come from the mouths of people who have had to live.
-Mark Twain

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