[Ads-l] Restricted access to "Stars and Stripes" and "The buck stops here"

Wed Feb 11 20:29:58 UTC 2015

Or maybe derived from deer crossing signs.  (Back when there were separate crossings according to gender of deer.)

LH

On Feb 11, 2015, at 2:46 PM, Dan Goncharoff wrote:

> Just a question: is the phrase "The Buck Stops Here" derived from the bus
> stop signs reading "The bus stops here"?
> 
> DanG
> 
> On Tue, Feb 10, 2015 at 11:57 AM, ADSGarson O'Toole <
> adsgarsonotoole at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
>> -----------------------
>> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>> Poster:       ADSGarson O'Toole <adsgarsonotoole at GMAIL.COM>
>> Subject:      Re: Restricted access to "Stars and Stripes" and "The buck
>> stops
>>              here"
>> 
>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> 
>> It is conceivable that some company was making signs with the motto in
>> the 1930s, but I have not seen any advertisements in that early time
>> period.
>> 
>> Ralph Keyes in "The Quote Verifier" (Page 18) indicated that the sign
>> on Truman's desk was not purchased; instead, it was custom made and
>> based on another sign.
>> 
>> [Begin excerpt]
>> "The BUCK stops here." This comment is so associated with Harry Truman
>> that it's easy to conclude the words came straight from his mouth.
>> They didn't. Early in Truman's presidency, a friend of his saw a sign
>> on the desk of an Oklahoma prison warden that read, THE BUCK STOPS
>> HERE. This friend had a replica made for the president and gave it to
>> him in October 1945. Truman displayed this sign on his desk off and on
>> for most of his presidency, and sometimes referred to it in speeches.
>> . .
>> [End excerpt]
>> 
>> I think A. B. Warfield was in a position in the military supply chain
>> where he could request the construction of a custom inscribed sign,
>> but I am not sure.
>> 
>> If you find any evidence of signs of this type for sale in the 1930s
>> please let me know.
>> 
>> Best wishes,
>> Garson
>> 
>> 
>> On Tue, Feb 10, 2015 at 11:34 AM, Jonathan Lighter
>> <wuxxmupp2000 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
>> -----------------------
>>> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>>> Poster:       Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>
>>> Subject:      Re: Restricted access to "Stars and Stripes" and "The buck
>> stops
>>>              here"
>>> 
>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> 
>>>> perhaps office supply or novelty shops came up with these signs.
>>> 
>>> That has long been my conjecture - based on my possibly erroneous
>>> interpretation of the sign mentioned in the magazine, but I haven't found
>>> any evidence to support it.
>>> 
>>> Was Truman's sign custom-made?
>>> 
>>> JL
>>> 
>>> On Tue, Feb 10, 2015 at 10:45 AM, Baker, John <JBAKER at stradley.com>
>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
>>>> -----------------------
>>>> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>>>> Poster:       "Baker, John" <JBAKER at STRADLEY.COM>
>>>> Subject:      Re: Restricted access to "Stars and Stripes" and "The buck
>>>> stops
>>>>              here"
>>>> 
>>>> 
>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> 
>>>> Garson, all of the early uses of "The buck stops here" are to desk signs
>>>> th=
>>>> at say that.  The earliest references say that Brigadier General A. B.
>>>> Warf=
>>>> ield had such a sign, and you suggest that he is the leading candidate
>> for
>>>> =
>>>> crafter of the expression.  Do you think the signs were all custom-made?
>>>> I=
>>>> 'm wondering if perhaps office supply or novelty shops came up with
>> these
>>>> s=
>>>> igns. =20
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> John Baker
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: American Dialect Society [mailto:ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On
>> Behalf
>>>> Of=
>>>> ADSGarson O'Toole
>>>> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2015 12:49 AM
>>>> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
>>>> Subject: Restricted access to "Stars and Stripes" and "The buck stops
>> here"
>>>> 
>>>> While preparing a website entry about the saying "The buck stops here"
>>>> I noticed a match in the "Stars and Stripes" in the NewspaperArchive
>>>> database. Unfortunately, additional detailed information about the
>>>> match was blocked, and the following message was displayed:
>>>> 
>>>> [Begin message]
>>>> This content has restricted access at the request of a rights holder
>>>> [End message]
>>>> 
>>>> Below is the partial information that subscribers to the
>>>> NewspaperArchive database are shown:
>>>> 
>>>> Newspaper: Washington Stars and Stripes
>>>> Date: Sat, May 23, 1942
>>>> Location: Washington, District Of Columbia
>>>> Database: NewspaperArchive
>>>> 
>>>> [Begin raw OCR match text]
>>>> they get around to awarding a Sympathy Medal, 1st Lt. Joseph A.
>>>> Dooley. Quartermaster Corps, should lead the parade for citations. On
>>>> his desk a sign reads: . The Buck Stops Here." ^ Aid ' Measure s |
>>>> Awaits Vote Biggest Convoy of War Arrives as Troops Pour into Ireland
>>>> Tank Units WASHINGTO
>>>> [End raw OCR match text]
>>>> 
>>>> Does someone have access to the full newspaper page image for this
>>>> citation=
>>>> ?
>>>> 
>>>> There is now an entry on the Quote Investigator website on this "The
>>>> Buck Stops Here". At this time, the citation from the "Stars and
>>>> Stripes" has been omitted:
>>>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__quoteinvestigator.com_2015_02_07_buck-2Dstops_&d=AwIBaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7p2JCsUVXU_eW2loICedypL8MZkMnlboSzi-BA7dtps&s=QTdVN8QuRyDEZQ_r6NAwpUl60tRHB0oi4U9kYgywjkY&e= 
>>>> 
>>>> Thanks for any help you can provide,
>>>> Garson
>>>> 
>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> The American Dialect Society - https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.americandialect.org&d=AwIBaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7p2JCsUVXU_eW2loICedypL8MZkMnlboSzi-BA7dtps&s=p-jF0igcMfBKRiAMAqbik-wFrfKCR-uyAHUv2ClTpZg&e= 
>>>> 
>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------
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>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> "If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the
>> truth."
>>> 
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>> 
>> ------------------------------------------------------------
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>> 
> 
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