[Ads-l] batshit

Mon Dec 12 01:02:34 UTC 2016

At http://english.stackexchange.com/questions/38354/where-did-the-phrase-batsht-crazy-come-from we read that while histoplasmosis may indeed be implicated, the first occurrences of “batshit” were as variants of “bullshit”.  Clearly, the meaning has shifted over the decades.  Given the standardly assumed culpability cat poop in the spread of *toxo*plasmosis (a danger I still somewhat suspect of having been exaggerated if not wholly invented to give pregnant women an excuse to have their partners clean the litter box full time for the duration of gestation), I wondered whether “catshit crazy” also occurred, and it does—99 actual g-hits.  Still pales next to batshit and histoplasmosis, but it’s not *that* shabby…

LH

> On Dec 11, 2016, at 6:24 PM, Barretts Mail <mail.barretts at GMAIL.COM> wrote:
> 
> Fascinating theory, thank you! The timeline of histoplasmosis on Wikipedia (https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Histoplasmosis-23History&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=Q8K54hclGiMKW6TYRNp9_LY_uM5161rDn-eDSo4tAV4&e=  <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Histoplasmosis-23History&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=Q8K54hclGiMKW6TYRNp9_LY_uM5161rDn-eDSo4tAV4&e= >) matches well with the citations. BB
> 
>> On 11 Dec 2016, at 15:21, David Champion <dgc.ads at BIKESHED.US> wrote:
>> 
>> I have been under the impression that "batshit crazy" derives
>> from the possibility of delirious or psychotic behavior induced
>> by histoplasmosis acquired through inhalation of fungus from bat
>> guano.  I find a few allusions to this medical possibility, e.g.
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov_pmc_articles_PMC4520962_&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=8QhaOjEsZowLe2BQvo3c9lwnv93qgtdPXu-fy-ldb-Y&e= , but nothing
>> detailed in a cursory search.
>> 
>> Not sure this is well substantiated, but it sounds great.
>> 
>> 
>> * On 11 Dec 2016, Barretts Mail wrote: 
>>> The online Oxford Dictionary (https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.oxforddictionaries.com_definition_batshit&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=VMFMAKFD3K45Veje4TGfwre0TUxrggyT7VrO80sRq6M&e=  <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.oxforddictionaries.com_definition_batshit&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=VMFMAKFD3K45Veje4TGfwre0TUxrggyT7VrO80sRq6M&e= >) says that “batshit” is an adjective meaning completely crazy. That meaning seems odd to me (e.g., “she’s batshit” or “that’s a batshit idea") but Wiktionary (https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wiktionary.org_wiki_batshit&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=1Pny5jmMeks4H4THgP6LOEjxxJDTxhmqjcdz964d3HM&e=  <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wiktionary.org_wiki_batshit&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=1Pny5jmMeks4H4THgP6LOEjxxJDTxhmqjcdz964d3HM&e= >) and the Urban Dictionary (https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.urbandictionary.com_define.php-3Fterm-3Dbatshit&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=YI10Swiaoq1s5C6tHirmFLO3qPO3xZJ1u4uISz4kdWg&e=  <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.urbandictionary.com_define.php-3Fterm-3Dbatshit&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=YI10Swiaoq1s5C6tHirmFLO3qPO3xZJ1u4uISz4kdWg&e= >) concur.
>>> 
>>> I consider “batshit” to be an adverb particularly in collations such as “batshit crazy”, which Wiktionary and the UD have.
>>> 
>>> About the origin, the Wiktionary talk page (https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wiktionary.org_wiki_Talk-3Abatshit&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=M_NGIBqZ5-LSXOJ8x_yjG--6kYyEdTkpV_cJedi2Ei0&e=  <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wiktionary.org_wiki_Talk-3Abatshit&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=M_NGIBqZ5-LSXOJ8x_yjG--6kYyEdTkpV_cJedi2Ei0&e= >) has mention of an opinion on some forum that this usage of “batshit" comes from “bats in the belfry.” That expression has seemed dated to me for at least twenty years but could certainly be accurate given the dates and the contexts of the citations below. For “batshit crazy,” however, the irregular flitting movement of bats is a better metaphorical image to me.
>>> 
>>> "The New Partridge Dictionary of Slang and Unconventional English” (https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__bit.ly_2hjnjTb&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=dYLhxvctEgypIzGEkR480P7Z9he0teb3ZFt1jSxgNm8&e=  <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__bit.ly_2hjnjTb&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=dYLhxvctEgypIzGEkR480P7Z9he0teb3ZFt1jSxgNm8&e= >, 2015, edited by Tom Dalzell and Terry Victor) have both parts of speech, the adjective to 1972 and the adverb to 1988.
>>> 
>>> 1. "End Over End” (https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__bit.ly_2hdKEbB&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=EHw8BXdT8tuahSJ6r9UMvH2xIsnKTrtoZ2Xlj0KE790&e=  <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__bit.ly_2hdKEbB&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=EHw8BXdT8tuahSJ6r9UMvH2xIsnKTrtoZ2Xlj0KE790&e= >, 1946, by Nelson Gidding, date confirmed by https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Nelson-5FGidding&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=qELOz8ZIDWf6iLV_b8fK0H9KMExQmPu0y7g2eqllzfs&e=  <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Nelson-5FGidding&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=qELOz8ZIDWf6iLV_b8fK0H9KMExQmPu0y7g2eqllzfs&e= >).
>>> 
>>> —— 
>>> … the evading American airman. Batshit. They …
>>> Batshit. He was indulging in housemaids’ theology.
>>> Batshit. You’ll never get a cigarette that way.
>>> 
>>> 2. “The Longest Way Round” (https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__bit.ly_2gPn7uj&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=y-8K9dH_zLNr3mtOpWmf8QWOhXSdz540B47QD0oB2tQ&e=  <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__bit.ly_2gPn7uj&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=y-8K9dH_zLNr3mtOpWmf8QWOhXSdz540B47QD0oB2tQ&e= >, 1958 Google-dated, by Bart Cole) has the term three times. 
>>> 
>>> ——
>>> And the goddamn wire broke, he thought, when I felt the minute hand of that bat shit of a Judas clock stand up to me.
>>> “Oh bat shit,” I said. “I’m going home.”
>>> “Bat shit,” I said. “You do not have to go if you don’t want to.”
>>> ——
>>> 
>>> The dating seems accurate as per https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__bit.ly_2hdPyoJ&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=wk6ilZa1QGa75JEx5TEaKI5VV6Hiswjr9X39xgu2VxA&e=  <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__bit.ly_2hdPyoJ&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=wk6ilZa1QGa75JEx5TEaKI5VV6Hiswjr9X39xgu2VxA&e= > and https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__bit.ly_2hBuBB7&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=TQjlkYXhAtqpCptL5bLZn2eItzP9crivj8zjIEY4P8k&e=  <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__bit.ly_2hBuBB7&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=TQjlkYXhAtqpCptL5bLZn2eItzP9crivj8zjIEY4P8k&e= >. But FWIW, "Return to the Beach” (https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__bit.ly_2hBv1aN&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=cAF7lo9TUhCozPeXFHVsMQ5e_VVsLkDrKOBwuWl2yo0&e=  <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__bit.ly_2hBv1aN&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=cAF7lo9TUhCozPeXFHVsMQ5e_VVsLkDrKOBwuWl2yo0&e= >, 1950 Google-dated, by Margaret Shedd) has the same Judas clock line.
>>> 
>>> Benjamin Barrett
>>> Formerly of Seattle, WA
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>>> The American Dialect Society - https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.americandialect.org&d=CwIFaQ&c=-dg2m7zWuuDZ0MUcV7Sdqw&r=wFp3X4Mu39hB2bf13gtz0ZpW1TsSxPIWYiZRsMFFaLQ&m=7KvzPERoHB0Bn5AAcs7PPOz2MOp9-NoCbxNYwDHlQSk&s=Pp1LZgeoBlqQFUp2RgoNkkko219x7w4xY_MuHhNBhGA&e= 
>> 
>> -- 
>> David Champion • dgc at bikeshed.us
>> 
>> ------------------------------------------------------------
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> 
> 
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