[Ads-l] Hail Mary pass/play/shot

Fri Feb 23 23:21:51 UTC 2018

Here's the link to Peter's latest post:

https://esnpc.blogspot.com/2018/02/from-stuhldreher-to-castner-and-crowley.html

FYI, I posted the Jan. 1, 1932 cite from the Rochester Democrat & Chronicle
(with Jim Crowley's Notre Dame anecdote) last September, in connection with
a WSJ column I wrote on the expression.

http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/ads-l/2017-September/149569.html

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 3:35 PM, Peter Reitan <pjreitan at hotmail.com> wrote:

> I just posted a piece on my blog about the origins of the "Hail Mary
> pass," with credit to Bill Mullin and Garson O'Toole who posted about the
> expression here in January.  I found some additional information on Gary
> Ashwill's AgateType blog<http://agatetype.typepad.
> com/agate_type/2010/10/hail-mary.html>, http://agatetype.typepad.com/
> agate_type/2010/10/hail-mary.html .
>
>
> I did find one slight antedating of "Hail Mary" in sports.  In January,
> Bill Mullins posted an example of a "Hail Mary shot" in basketball dated
> March 4, 1931, which was then the earliest example of a sports-related
> "Hail Mary", so it was unclear which came first - basketball or football.
>
> http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/ads-l/2018-January/150581.html
>
>
> The earliest football "Hail Mary" was Jim Crowley's frequently-told
> anecdote about saying "Hail mary" in the huddle of a 1922 Notre Dame win
> over Georgia Tech.
>
>
> Bill Mullins posted an example of the story from 1934.  The earliest
> example of that story I found dates to 1932. Democrat and Chronicle
> (Rochester, New York) January 1, 1932, page 28.
>
>
> But I also found a different story, about a charity game between Notre
> Dame and the New York Football Giants featuring a reunion of the Four
> Horsemen of Notre Dame.  Notre Dame was severly outmatched and resorted to
> saying "Hail Mary's" in the huddle to catch their breath before the next
> beating.  This story appeared a couple months before the basketball
> example, so it is possible that the football "Hail Mary" may have predated
> the basketball "Hail Mary."
>
>
>
> Green Bay Press-Gazette, January 3, 1931, page 15:
>
>
> "Crowley said that after a few minutes of that game the Four Horsemen
> stalled on every play by saying four or five “Hail marys” in the huddle;
> but that after a while they could not do any better than the “Amen.”"
>
> [END]
>
>
> Interestingly, Jim Crowley played under Coach Curly Lambeau in high
> school, at Green Bay's East High, and during one season playing for the
> Packers, and he coached Vince Lombardi for four years at Fordham.
>
>
> Peter Reitan
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> on behalf of
> ADSGarson O'Toole <adsgarsonotoole at GMAIL.COM>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2018 2:22 AM
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Hail Mary pass/play/shot
>
> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> -----------------------
> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       ADSGarson O'Toole <adsgarsonotoole at GMAIL.COM>
> Subject:      Re: Hail Mary pass/play/shot
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> -------------------
>
> Excellent work, Bill. Individuals interested in the evolution of "Hail
> Mary pass" and "Hail Mary shot" may enjoy the citations below for
> "prayer shot" which seems to be a precursor.
>
> Date: December 26, 1916
> Newspaper: The Scranton Republican
> Newspaper Location: Scranton, Pennsylvania
> Article: Local Quints Divide Honors
> Quote Page 10, Column 6
> Database: Newspapers.com
>
> [Begin excerpt]
> Scranton was first to score in the nightcap, a foul goal by Long
> making the totals 11 to 10. Muller followed with a prayer shot for a
> deuce that sent Nanticoke ahead but Berger came through with a two
> pointer that again changed the leadership.
> [End excerpt]
>
>
> Date: December 14, 1921
> Newspaper: The New Castle Herald
> Newspaper Location: New Castle, Pennsylvania
> Article: Castles Take Wampum Over In Fast Game
> Quote Page 13, Column 5
> Database: Newspapers.com
>
> [Begin excerpt]
> The third quarter Wampum made some "prayer" shots and were fighting
> hard to win, but could not overcome the lead and the quarter ended
> with the score at 30 to 21.
> [End excerpt]
>
>
> Date: January 3, 1922
> Newspaper: The New Castle Herald
> Newspaper Location: New Castle, Pennsylvania
> Article: Castles Take Wampum Over In Fast Game
> Quote Page 13, Column 5
> Database: Newspapers.com
>
> [Begin excerpt]
> At the beginning of the second extra period, Kraft put his team in the
> lead with a field goal, but Bessemer plugged on and tossed in two
> "prayer" shots winning out 24-22.
> [End excerpt]
>
>
> Date: December 12, 1929
> Newspaper: Green Bay Press-Gazette
> Newspaper Location: Green Bay, Wisconsin
> Article: Fort Howard. Morley Cage Quintets Win
> Quote Page 13, Column 5
> Database: Newspapers.com
> Note: The page image states year 1927, but the previous and next
> images have 1929
>
> [Begin excerpt]
> Finding the Fort Howard defense invulnerable, the railroaders
> abandoned their floor game early in the contest and took to the air
> with long distant "prayer shots."
> [End excerpt]
>
> Garson
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 17, 2018 at 3:24 AM, Bill Mullins <amcombill at hotmail.com>
> wrote=
> :
> >
> > From NPR yesterday:
> >
> > " You've heard of the Hail Mary pass, right? Well, you can think the
> Viki=
> ngs for that. The phrase Hail Mary pass was first used in 1975 after the
> Da=
> llas Cowboys' last-second miracle touchdown pass beat the Vikings."
> >
> > OED has 1972 for "Hail Mary play", 1982 for "Hail Mary touchdown pass",
> b=
> ut nothing for specifically "Hail Mary pass".  In the ADS-L archives, Sam
> C=
> lements found "Hail Mary pass plays" 8/29/1974; Ben Zimmer found "Hail
> Mary=
>  shot" 12/20/1965 (and clipped on Newspapers.com 12/17/1971 for "Hail Mary
> =
> play").  Barry Popik has found "Hail Mary play" (with a literal Hail Mary)
> =
> in 1939.
> >
> >
> > Hail Mary play
> >
> > Monroe LA _Monroe News-Star_ 11/5/1934 p 5 col 5
> >
> > "Presbyterian Finds 'Hail Mary' Play Notre Dame's Best" [headline --
> this=
>  is the same literal usage as Barry's 1939 cite.]
> >
> >
> > _Philadelphia Daily News_ 11/8/1971 p 64 col 5
> >
> > "Another sideline discussion led to what the sandlotters call the 'Hail,
> =
> Mary' play -- a long pass and a prayer."
> >
> >
> > Hail Mary pass
> >
> > St. Petersburg FL _Tampa Bay Times_ 12/31/1940 p 11 col 6
> >
> > "A "Hail Mary" pass, in the talk of the Washington eleven, is one that
> is=
>  thrown with a prayer because the odds against completion are big."
> >
> >
> > _Hartford Courant_ 10/13/1959 p 19 col 1
> >
> > ""They call it their Martin Luther play," the Yale scout said. "The same
> =
> thing at Notre Dame would be called the Hail Mary pass.""
> >
> >
> > Hail Mary shot
> >
> > New Brunswick NJ _Central New Jersey Home News_ 3/4/1931 p 13 col 4
> >
> > "Sister Helen Rose, at St. Peter's High, calls Miss Virginia Bahash's
> sho=
> ts, "Hail Mary shots."  You know the kind -- given 'em a fling and breathe
> =
> a prayer."  [basketball]
> >

------------------------------------------------------------
The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org