[Ads-l] Seen

Sat Aug 8 17:55:56 UTC 2020

I just looked the expression up in two English-Yiddish dictionaries to see if the prepositional difference for two NYC speakers was somehow linked to Yiddish speaking households (mine was when I was very young).  It didn't help - Weinreich has 'sick in (!) the stomach' and Schaechter has 'sick to the stomach' but neither Yiddish equivalent has a preposition at all.  Ah well, 'twas an idea...

Margaret

----------------------------
MARGARET E WINTERS
Former Provost
Professor Emerita - French and Linguistics
Wayne State University
Detroit, MI  48202

mewinters at wayne.edu

________________________________
From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> on behalf of Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at YALE.EDU>
Sent: Saturday, August 8, 2020 1:48 PM
To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Seen

I had that one too, but I’m not sure if the variation was free or conditioned (and if so, on what).

> On Aug 8, 2020, at 1:47 PM, Margaret Winters <mewinters at WAYNE.EDU> wrote:
>
> Interesting, Larry - I'm only a couple of years younger, also NYC and the only expression I knew was (and continued to be until this discussion came up here) 'sick to my stomach'.
>
> best to all,
> Margaret
>
> ----------------------------
> MARGARET E WINTERS
> Former Provost
> Professor Emerita - French and Linguistics
> Wayne State University
> Detroit, MI  48202
>
> mewinters at wayne.edu
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> on behalf of Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at YALE.EDU>
> Sent: Saturday, August 8, 2020 1:45 PM
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Subject: Re: Seen
>
> Hmmm.  I grew up with “sick at my stomach” (or more generally “sick at one’s stomach” as in the DARE entry.  Not familiar with “sick at the stomach”.  I like Kurath’s note:
>
>> In southern New England and in
>> Greater New York City at is now fairly common among younger and cultured
>> persons.
>
> That was me in 1949, a very cultured younger speaker in NYC at age 4, not infrequently sick at his stomach.
>
> LH
>
>
>> On Aug 8, 2020, at 1:08 AM, Ben Zimmer <bgzimmer at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> DARE has "sick at one’s stomach" (and variants including "sick at the
>> stomach") under the entry for "at" and labels it "widespread exc North,
>> though gaining currency throughout US." The relevant map from the DARE
>> surveys of 1965-70 shows the usage was indeed widespread at the time,
>> though I wonder if it has been "gaining currency" since then or receding.
>>
>> Map: https://www.daredictionary.com/view/maps/atprep2map.png
>>
>> From the "at" entry:
>>
>> 2 in phr _sick at one’s stomach_ and varr: Nauseated. widespread exc North,
>> though gaining currency throughout US
>> 1731 in 1906 Essex Inst. Coll. 42.224 MA, I am something better to day than
>> yesterday at my Stomack.
>> 1882 Sweet & Knox Texas Siftings 80 (DAE), When he is sick at his stomach .
>> . he goes to Col. Andrews for advice.
>> 1949 Kurath Word Geog. 78, _At the stomach_ is usual in all of the South
>> and the Midland and is not uncommon in Greater New York City, Connecticut,
>> and Rhode Island. In the greater part of New England and the rest of the
>> Northern area it is exceedingly rare. . . In southern New England and in
>> Greater New York City at is now fairly common among younger and cultured
>> persons.
>> 1965-70 DARE
>> Qu. BB16a, If something a person ate didn’t agree with him, he might be
>> sick __ his stomach
>> 408 Infs, widespread exc Nth, At; DC1, DE6, GA59, LA18, 25, 31, 40, At the;
>> NV8, At the belly; LA2, At the craw; MO20, At the tummy;
>> Qu. BB16b
>> Infs IN54, LA8, OK18, Sick at his stomach; MO39, OH42, Sick at the stomach;
>> CA212, Upset at the stomach;
>> Qu. BB17
>> Infs CA209, CO33, DE6, GA59, MI62, MO29, NJ9, VA42, (Be) sick at his (or
>> the, your) stomach;
>> Qu. H69
>> Inf TX91, Makes me sick at my stomach;
>> Qu. II29b
>> Infs IN45, VA58, Makes me sick at my (or the) stomach.
>>
>> On Sat, Aug 8, 2020 at 12:07 AM Wilson Gray <hwgray at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> In the last, long-leaping line an NYT book-review by a native of New
>>> Orleans:
>>>
>>> "... sick at the stomach." I.e. "nauseated."
>>>
>>> This is the phrase that I grew up using in East Texas. Never seen it in
>>> print afore.
>>>
>>> https://nyti.ms/3gEkdHZ
>>>
>>>
>>
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