[Ads-l] Antedating of "Tick-Tack-Toe"

Thu Jul 13 11:36:37 UTC 2023

Nice work, guys.

The variant with /k/ must be considerably older than its appearance in
print.

This critique of a painting seems to be a way of saying "three in a row." :

1845 _N. Y. Herald_ (May 3)  2: _Group of Children, by G. Linden -- Very
badly arranged -- tit, tat, toe.

And consider:

1851 _The Lutheran Observer_ (Baltimore, Md.) (Nov. 14) 596:
Tit-tat-toe--/ My first go:/ Three jolly butcher boys all in a row!/ Stick
one up-- /Stick one down--/ Stick one in the old man's burying ground!

JL

On Wed, Jul 12, 2023 at 8:56 PM Peter Reitan <pjreitan at hotmail.com> wrote:

> 1850, a memoir about a trip to California, the author says she taught "tit
> tat toe and some of her old school games" to a child on the ship.
>
> HathiTrust
>
> https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=nyp.33433076065634&view=1up&seq=30&q1=%22Tit%20tat%22
> ________________________________
> From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> on behalf of
> Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>
> Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2023 5:21:26 PM
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Subject: Re: Antedating of "Tick-Tack-Toe"
>
> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> -----------------------
> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at GMAIL.COM>
> Subject:      Re: Antedating of "Tick-Tack-Toe"
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> The JL in 1879 is a typo.
>
> On Wed, Jul 12, 2023 at 8:19=E2=80=AFPM Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at gmai
> =
> l.com>
> wrote:
>
> > I've got some more, though it isn't quite clear which game is alluded to:
> >
> > 1879_ Chicago Tribune_ (Sept. 4) 5: Is one Nicholas Bramgan, recently
> > liberated from the Penitentiary at Joliet, in the employ of the city as
> > policeman or give-away, or is he simply playing a little game of "tick,
> > tack, toe," like Martin Flanagan?JL
> >
> > 1885 _St. Albans [Vt.] Daily Messenger_ (Feb. 28) 3: Even the teacher
> > will... take a slate and sit down wit [sic] a girl and play what is
> calle=
> d
> > tick-tack-toe.
> >
> > It may be that "tic-tac-toe" began as a counting rhyme like
> > eeny-meeny-miny-mo:
> >
> > 1885 _Washington Standard_ (Olympia, Wash.) (Nov. 6) 1: Tic, tac, toe;
> le=
> t
> > the Chinese lepers go./...Get out of this, get out of that./ Tic-tac-toe.
> >
> > There's this:
> >
> > 1862 _Weekly Times (Burlington, Vt.) (Nov. 8) 7: NEW MUSIC.
> > Songs....Kingdom Coming (Negro melody)....Tick-Tack-Toe, - A song for the
> > times.
> >
> > And:
> >
> > 1874 _Manchester Guardian_  (March 6) 6: The children in [the painting]
> > "Tick! Tack! Toe!"...are just as bad.
> >
> > JL
> >
> > On Wed, Jul 12, 2023 at 7:39=E2=80=AFPM ADSGarson O'Toole <
> > adsgarsonotoole at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Interesting topic, JL. Excellent lead, Fred.
> >> The phrase "Tic-tac-toe, three in a row" occurs below in 1878 (I
> >> think), but it is not clear whether it refers to the game of today.
> >>
> >> Part of the text is cut off in the scan.
> >>
> >> Date: 1878 October
> >> Periodical: New Dominion Monthly
> >> Published by John Dougall & Son, Montreal
> >> Section: Young Folks
> >> Article: A Life in the Stage: A Story for Boys
> >> Start Page 462, Quote Page 466, Column 2
> >>
> >>
> >>
> https://books.google.com/books?id=3DV685RfuwRmQC&q=3D%22Tic%2C+tac%22#v=
> =3Dsnippet&
> <https://books.google.com/books?id=3DV685RfuwRmQC&q=3D%22Tic%2C+tac%22#v==3Dsnippet&>
> >>
> >> [Begin excerpt - please double check text and date]
> >> But can this comfortable, ea...
> >> going man, who walks up to the v...
> >> andah and seating himself on the
> >> vacant chair says with a quiet laugh
> >> "Tic-tac-toe, three in a row--...
> >> this be our little thin, pale-faced S...
> >> [End excerpt]
> >>
> >> The cut-off words might be "easy" and veranda".
> >>
> >> Garson
> >>
> >> On Wed, Jul 12, 2023 at 7:03=E2=80=AFPM Shapiro, Fred <fred.shapiro at yale
> =
> .edu>
> >> wrote:
> >> >
> >> > Correction: In the 1908 citation it is "tack" rather than "tock."
> >> >
> >> > Fred Shapiro
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > ________________________________
> >> > From: Shapiro, Fred <fred.shapiro at yale.edu>
> >> > Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2023 7:01 PM
> >> > To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> >> > Subject: Antedating of "Tick-Tack-Toe"
> >> >
> >> > tick-tack-toe (OED, b., 1960)
> >> >
> >> > 1895 _St. Louis Post-Dispatch_ 10 Dec. 7/1 (Newspapers.com)  It was
> >> "tick, tack, toe, three in a row."
> >> >
> >> > 1908 _Cincinnati Enquirer_ 9 July 2/6 (Newspapers.com)  Up to the
> stag=
> e
> >> they went, tick, tock, toe, three in a row. like the figures we used to
> >> make on our slate when the teacher wasn't looking.
> >> >
> >> > Fred Shapiro
> >> >
> >> > ------------------------------------------------------------
> >> > The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
> >>
> >> ------------------------------------------------------------
> >> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > "If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the
> truth=
> ."
> >
>
>
> --=20
> "If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the truth."
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>

-- 
"If the truth is half as bad as I think it is, you can't handle the truth."

------------------------------------------------------------
The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org