[Ads-l] Why "Orangemen" ?

[Laurence Horn]

> On May 12, 2024, at 7:50 AM, Shapiro, Fred <fred.shapiro at YALE.EDU> wrote:
> 
> An interesting and plausible theory, Dave.
> 
> The only other U.S. college nickname I have found in the OED pertains to my own employer: "Yalie."  This may have gotten in because of the popularity of Erich Segal's book _Love Story_.
> 
> My favorite college nickname is "Hoyas" (Georgetown), which I believe means the "whats".
> 
> Fred Shapiro
> 
> ________________________________
> From: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU> on behalf of dave at wilton.net <dave at WILTON.NET>
> Sent: Sunday, May 12, 2024 7:17 AM
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Subject: Re: Why "Orangemen" ?
> 
> 
> Perhaps because the Syracuse sense, Orangeman n.2, is distinct from Orangeman n.1, that is "a person who espouses Protestant political principles, esp. in Northern Ireland." I would bet there were questions to the dictionary editors about whether or not the Syracuse nickname was somehow related to the Irish question. The n.1. entry had been in the dictionary since the first edition; the n.2 entry was added in June 2004. Such questions, especially ones relating the politics of Northern Ireland, don't arise with other US team names.
> 
> Also, the Syracuse entry was added to the dictionary in June 2004. In May 2004 the university had officially changed the "Orangemen" name to the gender-neutral "the Orange" (under pressure from Nike who supplied the team uniforms for both the men's and women's teams). That made significant news headlines at the time. But that is a very fast turnaround for a new dictionary entry, and the entry says nothing about the name change, so it seems more likely the entry was already in the works when the news of the name change broke.

Not as effectively killing-two-birds-with-one-stoney as the erstwhile St. John’s Redmen (formerly a Big East conference-mate of the Syracuse Orange) rebranding as the Red Storm. OED has for “red man” (two words)

‘A Indigenous person of North America. Also (with the): Indigenous people of North America collectively. Now historical. Now generally considered offensive.’  [sic; not sure why it’s not “An Indigenous person…”]

But no listing for the now both ’archaic’ and ’[sometimes] considered offensive' former nickname for St. John’s students/athletes.  Too obscure, no doubt. FWIW, Red Man (or Redman) Tobacco survives as such.  

LH
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: "Shapiro, Fred" <fred.shapiro at YALE.EDU>
> Sent: Saturday, May 11, 2024 4:08pm
> To: ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
> Subject: [ADS-L] Why "Orangemen" ?
> 
> 
> 
> One curious thing I have noticed in the OED is that there is an entry for "Orangeman" in reference to affiliates or sports teams of Syracuse University. Why "Orangeman' and not more famous nicknames like Trojan, Longhorn, Fighting Irish, Crimson, Crimson Tide, etc. ?
> 
> Fred Shapiro
> 
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