diffusionism

[Mike Cleven]

terry glavin wrote:

> <snip>
>
> for years. i've been fascinated with the history of the human presence on
> the north pacific, and i'd just finished a 14,000-word chapter on the
> antiquity of north pacific maritime traditions (i.e. 3 a.m. december 23 sent
> it off to the publisher) when i read linda's note about diffusionism in the
> "atlantic," which i picked up the next day during a last mad-dash christmas
> shopping trip to victoria. read the article on the ferry home, and thought -
> holy is this hilarious or what. most of the author's references i had
> already, others i have the author seems to be unaware of.
>
>  linda: i am interested in your query re a copper-hulled canoe. i AM aware
> of a story in the oral tradition that includes a copper-hulled canoe: it's
> part of the mowachaht origin myth (first woman god created at yuquot is
> visited by handsome men in a copper-hulled canoe), west coast vancouver
> island. you got another one?

Too much to comment on about Terry's article; wish I could post that to
soc.history.what-if, Terry, and sci.archaeology and alt.archaeology.  Fun stuff;
have to tell you about the cryptozoological opinion that the waters off the
Northwest are home to 90% of the remaining world sea serpent population, but
perhaps another time....

The copper canoe story I heard had to do with the Chinook people, so hopefully
Tony or another Grande Ronder might have the detailed account; I think what I
read came from the webpage put up about the Chinook Nation by a Jake Hilts back
in the early history of the List; it's not up anymore which is really too bad.
But I think it was there that I read the account of a copper-hulled canoe that
had come to the mouth of the Columbia.  Its inhabitant was well-dressed and
apparently tried to teach and trade with the Chinook of legend, who
unfortunately killed him and, um, may have also eaten him; I can't remember the
story and know how controversial cannibalism is; but a legend is a legend,
right?  After killing him and ransacking his "copper canoe", they somehow
realized their mistake in destroying him and his knowledge, and realized that he
came to help them.  To honour his memory, they each kept a chunk of the copper
hull, and this is supposed to be the origin of the use/meaning of coppers, at
least in that part of the Coast.

Now, there's no way of knowing _when_ this was, the legendary past being the
legendary past (and so inherently and intrinsically indeterminate of date), but
I'd go against the usual convention concerning Chinese expeditions because of
the well-known tradition of Korean armoured vessels, one of which was on display
at Expo '86 in Vancouver if anyone got to see it.  The hull plates just happen
to look very much about the same size as trade coppers; can't say for the shape,
but that's something that could change with adaption and fashion once coppers
became a medium of value and status.  I don't know if there are any Korean
records of such armoured vessels that never came home, but they are assiduous
record keepers and (depending on which archives were and weren't destroyed by
the Japanese over the centuries, or during the Korean War) there may just be
some bit of Korean history worth considering.  One interesting way to check this
- find the oldest, most "traditional" coppers known (i.e. passed down for
generations) and do an isotope test on the copper content; if I'm correct,
copper is like many metals in that each mine has its own distinctive "flavour".
Anyway, just an idea based on wild goose feathers....

Hadn't realized the thing about the pottery people near the Columbia;
interesting.  There's also the Sto:lo legend of Xa'xels to consider, the one
where his Transformer predecessors lectured the people of Xa:ytem to study
hunting and fishing and writing (of all things; maybe building or farming also?
can't remember), and they did not follow through on all three (four?), bringing
about the destruction of their village by the returned Xa'xels (now in one body)
and the transformation of their si:am to a huge boulder; those at the first
workshop who went to Xa:ytem the next day will remember the tale well, I think.
How is it that there was knowledge of writing here in ancient legend?  Seems to
me there was a lot more going on in this part of the world that we can never
know about, about which we only have hints......Terry knows where I'm going with
this; the idea that the disappearance of oral traditions, especially epics and
genealogies, are major losses to the historical consciousness of generations to
come, that tales that are no longer told have ceased to be part of conscious
reality, and are only present in dreams and wishes of times that may have
been.....

Merry Xmas and a Happy New Quadrillenium to all.....

Mike