Chinook and the Ethnologue

[Liland Brajant Ros']

>From: Tom Larsen <bvtl at ODIN.PDX.EDU>
>Reply-To: Tom Larsen <bvtl at ODIN.PDX.EDU>
>To: CHINOOK at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG
>Subject: Re: Tilicum
>Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 14:07:20 -0800
>
>Well, this is just another example of how you can't trust everything you
>read in Ethnologue.  Kiksht is not Lower Chinook, it's another name
>(actually the native name, if I'm not mistaken) for Upper Chinook.  It
>is my understanding that there are no speakers left of any kind of Lower
>Chinook ("Shoalwater", Clatsop). Tony Johnson would probably know more
>about this than I would, though. I note in the snippets from the
>Ethnologue that were cited that they have also classed Clackamas as
>Lower Chinook.  This is also incorrect.  Clackamas was a variety of
>Kiksht (Upper Chinook).

Liland: So I was apparently right in my previous statement about the
extinction of Lower Chinook.

I quite agree the Ethnologue is not reliable, however, it does provide
*some* information (even if incorrect) about virtually every documented
living or recently extinct language in the world, and a point from which to
start correcting, arguing, or nitpicking.

Liland (lilEnd)
>
>--
>Tom Larsen
>
>Monographic Cataloging Assistant
>Branford Price Millar Library
>Portland State University
>P.O. Box 1151
>Portland, OR 97207-1151
>
>phone: 503-725-8179
>fax:   503-725-5799
>
>email: larsent at pdx.edu
>
>
>Liland Brajant Ros' wrote:
> >
> > >From: Andy Horton <BMLSS at compuserve.com>
> > >...
> > >Sometimes, the etymon can only be intelligently guessed at
>and this applies
> > >to the toponymy of Saxon place names in England, and even
>more to the
> > >earlier Celtic names, as there were no written records.
> > >
> > >I assume that this also applies to the Wakashan Languages and
>where the
> > >words have been used in Chinook, it might not be possible to
>prove which
> > >language/tribe they came from, but some experts or
>enthusisasts might have
> > >a good idea from circumstantial evidence, hence the trawl.
> >
> > Sounds right to me except that Chinook is not Wakashan. At
>least, I've never
> > seen it so classified.
> >
> > Nootkan is Wakashan, and there are a fair number of important
>words of
> > Nootkan origin in the Chinook Jargon (holdovers, I gather the
>prevailing
> > scholarly opinion is, from a Nootkan-based Jargon of the
>pre-1800 period),
> > but "tIlEqEm" or however it's spelt nowadays is not one of
>them, it's
> > Chinook(an). Which is usually classified as a branch of
>Penutian.
> >
> > http://www.ethnologue.com/show_family.asp?subid=1728 (Penutian
>family tree,
> > per Ethnologue; much disputed.)
> >
> > Yesterday I said I thought the Chinookan languages (as
>distinct from the
> > Jargon) were extinct, but now I see that the Ethnologue shows
>12 speakers in
> > 1996 for Lower Chinook (the variety that provided the main
>basis for the
> > Jargon) and 69 (including 7 monolinguals!) in 1990 for
>Wasco-Wishram or
> > Upper Chinook (related). Here are the relevant entries and
>links from the
> > Ethnologue:
> >
> > CHINOOK [CHH] 12 speakers of Kiksht dialect (1996), out of a
>possible
> > population of 300 (1977 SIL).  Lower Columbia River, Oregon
>and Washington.
> > Alternate names: LOWER CHINOOK.  Dialects: KLATSOP (TLATSOP),
>CLACKAMA,
> > KIKSHT.  Classification: Penutian, Chinookan.  Nearly extinct.
> > http://www.ethnologue.com/show_language.asp?code=CHH
> >
> > Chinook Jargon:
> >      Under USA:
> > CHINOOK WAWA [CRW] 17 speakers in USA (1990 census).  Formerly
>used along
> > the Pacific coast from Oregon to Alaska. All speakers are
>probably now
> > scattered. Alternate names: CHINOOK JARGON, CHINOOK PIDGIN,
>TSINUK WAWA.
> > Classification: Pidgin, Amerindian.  Nearly extinct.
> >      Under Canada:
> > CHINOOK WAWA [CRW]  Population total both countries 100
>speakers, all over
> > 50 years old (1962 Chafe).  Alternate names: CHINOOK JARGON,
>CHINOOK PIDGIN.
> >   Classification: Pidgin, Amerindian.  Nearly extinct.
> > http://www.ethnologue.com/show_language.asp?code=CRW
> >
> > WASCO-WISHRAM [WAC] 69 speakers including 7 monolinguals (1990
>census), out
> > of a possible population of 750 (1977 SIL).  North central
>Oregon, south
> > central Washington. Alternate names: UPPER CHINOOK.
>Classification:
> > Penutian, Chinookan.  Nearly extinct.
> > http://www.ethnologue.com/show_language.asp?code=WAC
> >
> > http://www.ethnologue.com/show_family.asp?subid=1831 (Wakashan
>family tree,
> > per Ethnologue; generally accepted, I think)
> >
> > NOOTKA [NOO] 590 mother tongue speakers (1998 Statistics
>Canada), out of
> > 3,500 population (1977 SIL). Nitinat has about 30 speakers
>(1991 M. Dale
> > Kinkade).  Southwestern British Columbia, Nitinat along
>Pacific side of
> > Vancouver Island and on Nitinat Lake. Alternate names: NUTKA,
>NUUCHAHNULTH.
> > Dialects: NITINAT (NITINAHT), NOOTKA.  Classification:
>Wakashan, Southern.
> > http://www.ethnologue.com/show_language.asp?code=NOO
> >
> > Cheers yourself!
> >
> > lilEnd
> >
> >
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