CJ "man" borrowed as suffix into another Salish lg

[Leanne Riding]

Is there any possibility that Salish was the source of -man in CJ as we 
know it, or at least a major participant in causing -man to be present 
in CJ? I suggest this because Salish speakers could have contributed to 
CJ as early as 1811 or so, when Astor's outfit became interested in the 
Okanagan region.

David Robertson wrote:

>I've previously talked about how the Nlhe7kepmxcin / Thompson Salish 
>language borrowed "man" as a suffix that expresses someone's profession.  
>This was pointed out by the folks who wrote the book describing that 
>language's grammar, and they said it could be from English.  I pointed out 
>what I thought was good evidence that this was borrowed from Chinook Jargon 
>instead.  
>
>For one thing, in Thompson it occurs mostly in words for occupations that 
>came to that part of BC about the same time CJ did.  As Bill Turkel argues, 
>CJ became an important language in interior BC only when the gold rushes 
>occurred, circa 1858 and later.  (Beeson's edition of McInnes' diaries 
>emphatically claims 1859.  Hm.)  Examples are the words for prostitute, 
>water carrier, and so on.  Some of the words that take the "man" suffix 
>seem to have been used in local CJ, in fact.
>
>Now I've noticed that the St'at'imcets / Lillooet Salish language also 
>borrowed "man" as a suffix, also expressing one's typical occupation.  Here 
>also it looks like CJ played a key role.  Two examples given (in Van Eijk's 
>1997 book on Lillooet) come from common terms in local Chinook 
>Jargon, "tintin man" (bellringer) and "satiman" (song man, i.e. leader of 
>prayers & hymns).  Other examples he gives suggest an extension of the 
>suffix beyond "profession", as in the words for footracer and alcoholic.  
>
>I should point out (for you linguists reading this) that the Lillooet 
>version of the suffix is stressed when it occurs with the Salish roots 
>shown, and unstressed with the CJ roots.  The latter actually replicates 
>typical CJ stress patterns in compounds, and may suggest that we're seeing 
>different stages of nativization preserved in the lexicon.  (Unless it's 
>one of those variably stressed Salish affixes; we'd have to examine the 
>roots it occurs with to find out.)  
>
>Also there are two other Lillooet suffixes of very similar form, -m at n (with 
>a schwa) "instrument" and -min' (stressed, "leftover matter" [esp. from 
>work being done).  Van Eijk notes these may be related to each other, and 
>it's not impossible that CJ "man" was at least partly reanalyzed as a sort 
>of version of one or both of these.   
>
>The Thompson suffix, as far as I recall, is always stressed and therefore 
>looks more definitely like a single coherent morpheme.  Could Lillooet have 
>borrowed "man" from Thompson?  
>
>On a different note, Van Eijk analyzes Lillooet "satiman" as coming from 
>English "Saturday" + "man".  His reasoning: "referring to prayers said on 
>the eve of Saturday".  I strongly dispute this.  Local CJ was heavily under 
>the influence of the Catholic Durieu System, in which the "shanti man" 
>(song man) was one of the prominent local officials.  The term is frequent 
>both in Kamloops Wawa & in First Nations people's own CJ letters.  Some FN 
>people even took "Shantiman" in various pronunciations as a surname; one 
>pronunciation similar to the Lillooet, "shati" (sing / song), is also well-
>known from the Grand Ronde area in Oregon.  Besides, although prayers were 
>said on Saturdays at least in some villages, and perhaps more likely so in 
>those frequent weeks when the missionary priest was somewhere else, Sundays 
>were still the focus of worship services, as we know from the sources I've 
>just mentioned. "Satiman" surely comes from CJ. 
>
>--Dave R
>
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