[gothic-l] Citrus tree leaf

[Bertil Häggman]

Keth,

Your explanation underneath
is interesting but does not much pertain to the
question what kind of leaf Jordanes was 
referring to.

Also I thought we were discussing § 16 in Jordanes
while you seem to have extended the discussion to other
parts of _Getica_. 

In a number of messages I have related that Scandza is 
related to Scandinavia/Scadinavia and the reference
to Scania and the town name of Skanoer. Of course
it is possible that Scandza refers to Scania and the southern
part of the Scandinavian peninsula. But the discussion
of the "Screrefennae" (presumably the Saami) cannot be
related to Gutland or Scania. The sides, according to Jordanes,
are curved. I suppose it is not this statement that prompts
you to comment on fiords. Both Gotland and Goetaland have 
gulfs, in the case of Halland the Laholm Gulf and on the east
side between Scania and Blekinge there is also an inward
bight. North of Oestergoetland, Soedermanland and Uppland
are producing a bulge, but there is not much evidence, even in
the 6th century, that the Sandinavian peninsula was known that
far north in Italy.

To be able to say anything about thuja, it would be of
interest to know how the leaves look. Do you have any
knowledge of that?

The juniper of course is not the matter here but preferably
the citrus tree leaf, although I must admit I don't how a citrus
tree leaf looks. My visits to Spain and Italy have been for other
reasons than botanic studies. But you seem well versed 
on leaves and it would be of interest to know how
the two leaves look.

It seems of some interest to know how the various
leaves look to be able to compare to the outline
of Gotland and southern Scandinavia, don't you
agree?

California? Sorry, can't follow you there.

Gothically

Bertil



The Western part of
Scandinavia has always had extemely deep fjords, and this must have been
very notable to early visitors as well. The early descriptions of midnight
sun cannot be explained otherwise than that the classical authors had
heard, via via via, from people who had actually been there. If they noted
the midnight sun, they will of necessity also have noted the deep fjords.
If you want to describe such a coastline by means of a leaf analogy the
tuja leaf is a good choice because it too is deeply cut. But I thought I
already explained as much and it seems silly to prolong such a thread by
just repeating over and over again what has been said before. 

The african tuja was an important
tree to the romans since they used its wood for many purposes. but that is
all i know at present time. Jordanes is full of contradictions and the
passages we are discussing now seems like pastework, where different texts
have been subjected to a "cut and paste" treatment - texts that do not deal
with the same subject, but that Jordanes in his haste may have thought
dealt with the same topos. 

We Scandinavians know the "enbär"
has no leaves, but presumambly someone living in California wouldn't know
that, from which a possible cause for the mistranslation may be deduced.



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