[gothic-l] Re: Odin the man - medieval scholarship at its best

[konrad_oddsson <konrad_oddsson@yahoo.com>]

Háils Dirk!

> this story was likely not the attempt of a latent pagan who wanted 
to to apease zealous Christians. In contrast, the story of the 
migration of Odin and his followers is essentially borrowed from 
Frankish historiography which set out the origin of the Franks and 
adopted for the Norse (c.f Klingenberg and others).

I do not disagree that this story was adopted from some such source. 
Other Norse writers reveal a knowledge of the story, which must have 
been fashionable in Snorri´s day. I do disagree with those who claim 
that Snorri invented this story for some such purpose as to defile 
the native faith or to demote its Gods. I see no trace of any such 
bias in anything he wrote. Christians have accused him of demoting 
Christian kings and clergy by denying the miracles attributed to 
them in other writings. Like many writers, he clearly has his 
accusers. My own position is that he was a very objective scholar 
for his time time. This objectivity should be clear to anyone who 
has compared Snorri´s attitude toward religious topics, which are 
often controversial, with that of almost any other comtemporary 
western writer. I am not implying that Snorri had a bias in favour 
of the traditional faith, or any other faith for that matter, but 
only that he probably felt it necessary to preface anything wrote on 
the topic with some such story as the one in question. Having said 
that, his writing does at times show a fondness for old traditions.


 Snorri and other Norse 
> writers borrowed and used these stories, because their main aim 
was to give his own rulers and dynasties a grant history, by 
connecting them to the heroes of Troy.

This is likely the original reason for the story´s expansion.

 Many of the main characters of the 
> Illiad, that partly figured also in the history of the Franks, 
were also present in the Edda. Compare for example Memnon the father 
of Troer, whic Snorri called Munon, father of Tror, adding that 'we 
call him Tor'. Also about Trakia, Snorri writes that this is the 
same as 'Trudheim' (that kollum ver thrudheim) and about Frigia 
Snorri writes that 'we call it Frigg' ( er ver kollum Frigg).

As one who is fond of the Iliad, I have also noticed this. 

 Thus, the main thing that Snorri was interested in was to give the 
rulers of the Norse world (including his own dynasty) a 
representative history, which would put them at par with great 
dynasties like the Merovingians. 
> 
> 
This may well be the case. 
> 
> 
> While it is still a hot subject of 
>debate, it seems fairly clear that East Scandinavian matches Gothic 
> in certain areas where it differs from West Scandinavian. I have 
> studied and written on this topic myself, as have many others.
> 
> 
> If you consult Swedish linguists like Oesten Dahl (The Origin of 
> Scandinavian Languages, etc.) or C.C. Elert, you would get a very 
> different answer I am afraid.
> 
> Dirk

I disagree with those who believe that West Scandinavian is no 
further from Gothic that East Scandinavian and for good reason. 
There is hard evidence that the Eastern speech is closer. This 
became clear to me after researching several points on which Eastern 
Scandinavian differed from the Western. While I had no interest in 
this topic prior to this chance encounter, I soon discovered that 
others had observed and written on the topic before me. The evidence 
clearly supports the position that Gothic is more similar to Old 
Eastern Scandinavian than to Old Western Scandinavian. Do either 
Dahl or Elert explicitly deny this anywhere in their writings? If 
so, then what examples do they cite as evidence for the position 
that Gothic is no more similar to Old Eastern than to Old Western 
Scandinavian? I would be very curious to know.

Regards,
Konrad.


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