[gothic-l] Re: Tracing the Eruli

[Troels Brandt <trbrandt@post9.tele.dk>]

--- In gothic-l at yahoogroups.com, "Dr. Dirk Faltin <dirk at s...>"
<dirk at s...> wrote:
..........
> The presence of ethnic groups on the basis of isolated
archaelogical
> finds is very difficult to justify. By the same token we would have
> to speak of large numbers of Goths or Heruls in Thuringia, even
with
> princely graves and their own cultural group. Yet, these kind of
> ethnic attributions are not normally permissable, unless backed by
> sound historical sources.
>
> .............
> Again, East Germanic horse equipment and other items have been
found
> in much larger quantities in other areas (especially southern
> Germany). However, it was shown that this equipment was simply used
> by Alamannians. To make a strict ethnic attribution is tempting,
and
> archaeologists frequently subcome to this temptation if there is
> vague historical evidence to support the linke. However, it is
> usually not permissable and would be tantamount to arguing that any
> driver of a Toyota must be Japanese;-).

Hi Dirk

This must be your joke - or have you just obtained a doctorial degree
in archaeology since you are now turning all your earlier arguments
upside down?

The previous years you have several times told with certainty about
people settling in Germany or Poland without any historical
background. Since you changed your Yahoo profile you have brought up
doubtful historical speculations - some of them based on a few
personal names - to indicate new migrations, and you are now
following the Swedish archaeological school pleading that archaeology
does not tell about ethnicity - making the Swedes free to declare
their Vendel Culture to be the Lost Atlantis developed by local Svear
(nearly a joke too).

Regarding your Toyota-simplification: Eastgermanic finds in their own
surroundings, where we know they operated according to history and
influenced their neighbours, should not be surprising and do not
eliminate the significance of relatively large finds in a few places
along a travel route more than 1.000 kilometres long,
-if such finds do not appear at the trading places nearby,
-if there is no spread,
-if the equipment is of a kind not earlier used in the region, and
-if other tracks point in the same direction.
But let us wait and see. They are still escavating and the new finds
are not published yet.

I have noticed, that George was provoked to continue our eternal
discussion about the Heruls of Procopius going to Thule, and that
your claims once again were eliminated. We have to realise, that this
hyphotesis does not depend on a single detail, but on a long row of
independent, parallel indications from different disciplines leading
to the same result - with relatively few indications against - and no
stumbling blocks. If a stumbling block is found also the final
conclusion could be discussed here, and of course in other cases a
single element and a new aspect shall be tested and twisted - as
above. However this will not have significant impact on the
conclusion and it makes no sense every time to repeat the Procopius-
exercise (though important) or our view on the final conclusion -
which most listmembers already know and are tired to hear (avaible in
the archives). It is impossible to present the total complex of
arguments on a mailing-list, and very few participants and other
listmembers are otherwise prepared to evaluate the rest of the
arguments and elements - though they should not leave this to us.

Troels



You are a member of the Gothic-L list.  To unsubscribe, send a blank email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe at egroups.com>.

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/