[gothic-l] Re: Eruli in the West

Wed Feb 13 08:33:44 UTC 2002

> That there were connections in the fifth century between
> Scandinavia and Bohemia is testified by archeology (see Tejral and
> Arrhenius) and the Longobardic kings from the Gausi.

Hello Andreas,

I think that this link of Langobardic kings (ex genere gausus) with
Scandinavia is very tentative indeed. The Edictus Rothari mentions in
its king list the following names with 'ex genere'.

1. rex agilmund, ex genere gugingus.
10. audoin, ex genere gausus.
12. clep, ex genere beleos.
14. agilulf, turingus, ex genere anawas.
16. hariwald, ex genere caupus.
17. rotari rex, filius nandinig, ex genere harodos.

I think there firstly arises the problem of what the respective names
(gugingus, gausus, beleos, anawas, caupus, harodos) are really
refering to. Some authors have opted for names of clans, others for
names of gods or areas. Thus, Agiulf, who is actually called a
Thurginian may have been a member of a certain clan named 'Anawas'.
Cleph and Hariwald seemed to have been members of clans with the
names Beleos and Caupus, respectively. For Rothari the possibility
exists that 'harodos' referes to the Harudes tribe, mentioned already
at the time of Ceasar, but also a link to one of the names of Wodan
was also suggested.

However, with Agilulf being a Thuringian, it is also possible that
the 'ex genere harodos' of Rothari refered to the pagus Harudorum
(the Harudian area) in north Thuringia, which was the area were the
Thuringians who joined the Langobards in their move to Italy actually
came from. Thus, some authors (I think Hauptfeld, Lotter and
Menghin?) have argued that Audoin was most likely also a Thuringian,
with links to the pagus Harudorum and the Saxons who took over the
area after 533AD and who joined the Langobards in Italy, because of
these links with Audoin. In addition, a god Gaut was apparently also
worshiped as founder god among the Saxons, in the form of Hatha-Gaut,
and probably also known among the Thuringians.

cheers,
Dirk

> >
> > Furthermore Jordanes in _Getica_ (23-24) is presenting
> > the Eruli among Scandiae nationes. Then there is the
> > arguments for connection between Eruli names and Scadinavian,
> > presented on this list in detail. There is no need to go further
> > into that matter again. As Taylor argues in Hoops there is of
> > course (see above) the matter of close connection between
> > the Eruli and the Goti before the migration to the northern
> > shores of the Black Sea.
>
> this connection is nowhere testified. they are first mentioned
> together in the great expedition of 268.
> The raids also demonstrate an ability
> > of Eruli and Goti for managing ships (bewiesene Seetuechtigkeit).
>
> Look at the literature on the raids from Rappaport onwards till my
> own contribution and Maciej Salamon's article in Eos. Then you will
> find that the Goths used firsst local ships and sailors and then
the
> infrastructure of the Bosporan Kingdom before they ventured forth
> on their own. The Eruli both in the West and in the Black Sea seem
> to have used ships at once, those in the West seem to have come to
> the Rhine in their own ships.
> > There is also the detailed knowledge of Scandinavia of both
Procopius
> > and Jordanes. The growth of the Eruli in the 6th century also is
> > pointing to a continous addition by migrating Eruli from
Scandinavia.
>
> This is not born out by archeology. Look at the anthropological and
> archeological analysis in Tejral's articles. The connections are
there
> in grave goods in princely graves and it is not clear in what
direction
> import and export went.
> > Then of course there is the word erilaR on Scandinavian
runestones.
> > And finally the Eruli n Scandinavia after 512 AD.
> >
> > Are you then refuting all relation of the Eruli to Scandinavia?
>
> The relations are there in the fifth and sixth century and after
512
> according to Procopius and Jordanes we have to reckon with Eruli
> in Scandinavia. In the third century the Western Eruli started with
> the Chaibones from somewhere on the North sea coast. Their
> localization before 268 depends upon that of the Chaibones and
> those are a bit better testified by similar names in Ptolemaios and
> Strabon. From there or the Baltic the Maeotis Eruli could have
> started, too, but hat is only a reasonable guess. The sources give
us
> no information about them before 268,
>
> Kind regards
>                         Andreas
> ao.Univ.Prof.Dr.Andreas Schwarcz
> Institut fuer oesterreichische Geschichtsforschung
> Universitaet Wien
> Dr.Karl-Lueger-Ring 1
> A 1010 Wien
> Oesterreich
> tel.0043/1/42-77/272-16
> fax 0043/1/42-77/92-72
> email andreas.schwarcz at u...

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