[gothic-l] Gothic Archaeology was Re: Whence the Eruli

[george knysh]

--- Tore Gannholm <tore.gannholm at swipnet.se> wrote:
> >--- faltin2001 <dirk at smra.co.uk> wrote:
> >(an excellent summary of archaeological research on
> >the Goths)
> >****GK: A quick point between classes at the U.== I
> >think it is no longer possible to claim a
> Scandinavian
> >descent for the Goths viewed as an ethnos. Mass
> >migration across the Baltic seems out of the
> question.
> >But what recent archaeology does not apparently
> rule
> >out is the possibility of a smaller group
> infiltrating
> >the "locals" of Wielbark as their ruling class. And
> >all it takes for a "myth" such as that popularized
> by
> >Cassiodorus/Jordanes to evolve are the "traditions"
> of
> >one (eventually) ruling family, which are
> transposed
> >onto the entire people... I think more discussion
> of
> >this is warranted. See you all later.*****
> >
>
>(TG) George,
> What you write here sounds very logical. Wielbark is
> just a name.
> Maybe the culture in Gotland also was Wielbark.
>
> What we know is that there was much movement both
> way in the cultural area.
> A consequence is that customs and language tends to
> standardize.
>
> Even if Kaliff is no archaeologist but historian I
> think he has
> managed well with "Gothic connections" as a further
> bases for
> discussions.
>
> There is no doubt that as Gotland was a free trading
> area people have
> moved there and adapted to the Gotlandic language
> and the culture has
> received new impulses all the time.
>
> Tore
> --
*****GK: I've read Kaliff with great interest (and
must remember to pay the good people at Uppsala before
they start sending me reminder notices (:=))). === But
(I've lost the letter number) hadn't you argued
previously (perhaps on another list?)that according to
Wolongiewicz the earliest "Wielbark" graves could be
dated to the 2nd c. BC? I didn't see this reported in
Kaliff.=== Anyway, a couple of points that any
synthesis should have answers for: (1) Is it sheer
coincidence that the same name or variants thereof
(Goth, Gut, Gaut, etc. etc.) is shared by people on
both sides of the Baltic in the period in question?
How would this have come about? == If we accept Strabo
as speaking of the Goths then at least by the end of
the 1rst c. BC. Otherwise by the beginning of the 1rst
c. AD because Pliny's information is usually assigned
to the Roman expedition into the Baltic of the first
years AD.== (2) How do we explain the peculiar nature
of the Gothic monarchy as described by Tacitus?===
That's just for starters. Now I have to go to the U.
again and teach my people about St. Augustine. I'll
certainly mention the Goths in passing (:=))) See you
later.**********
>


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