[gothic-l] Gothic race?

[hrafnsnest]

Hails Alle,

Dirk wrote:
"The Goths were certainly not a race. They were a polity."

Hi Dirk,
** While I'm not disagreeing with this point, after all Dr. Edgar
Polome wrote:

"Iranians were often traveling companions of the EGmc. hosts during
the migration age: when the Gothic Kingdom in the Pontic area was
destroyed by the Huns in the 4th cent. CE, Alans, led be Safrax,
accompanied the Goths on their migration to territories controlled by
the Romans, and helped defeat the latter at Andrinopolis in 378 and
406, the same Alans crossed the Rhine with the invading GMC tribes;
they followed the Vandals though Spain in 409, all the way to North
Africa in 428-430 CE.  When Albuin, King of the Langobards, conquered
Italy in 568 CE, he was accompanied by Sarmatians and Turkish
Bulgarians."
	Ermanaric, Greutungian-Ostrogothic King, ruled from the
Ukraine.  Under his rule were Finns, Slavs, Antes, Heruli, Alans,
Huns, Sarmatians, and Aesti.  Many of these tribes will be pushed
West into the region of Hungary.  This is important to our view of
the EGmc. tribes, as it means they were exposed to all sorts of
Turkish and Iranian customs such as shamanism, religion, different
scripts, forms of warfare, and dress.  It has been conjectured that
the eagle style fibula worn by Gothic chieftains may have originated
from the Sassanian (Persian) royal vestments.
	And there is this from Jordanes (IX.58): "Let no one say that
this name (Getae) is quite foreign to the Gothic tongue, and let no
one who is ignorant cavil at the fact that the tribes of men make use
of many names, even as the Romans borrow from the Macedonians, the
Greeks from the Romans, the Sarmatians from the Germans, and the
Goths frequently from the Huns".

** I think a bit of clarification may be in order though.  If we
consider that fact that a Scando/Baltic "race", speaking a Germanic
language, migrates from the lower Vistula region to the Black Sea,
and "conquers", "assimilates", or absorbs those they came into
contact with, then of course they would be considered a "polity".
However, then the same argument could be applied to any such Germanic
tribe (or any other conquering "race").
At what point does one loose their racial identity?   Granted, today
we are made up of many different ethnic genes, but initially, the
people who left their Baltic homeland, were what many consider to be
a Gothic tribe.  Therein, I believe, lies the key.  They were
a "tribe" that was part of the Germanic "race".

Best,
Valulfr





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