Gothic religion (Was Re: new and in search of help Go.thunrs and thrums)

[Le Bateman]

Arianism was a  Heretical sect according to the Church of Rome.  Polycarp or 
Irenaeus punched him in the face at one of the church councils. One person 
anyway connected to an early disciple punched him.
Le
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Michael Erwin" <merwin at btinternet.com>
To: <gothic-l at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, July 29, 2006 12:51 PM
Subject: Re: [gothic-l] Gothic religion (Was Re: new and in search of help 
Go.thunrs and thrums)


Paganism

I'm not sure that traditions were very stable. Didn't the later Norse
incorporate various Gothic and Burgundian figures into their myth-
systems?

Christianity

First off, what is 'Arian?' Arius himself was important but not that
important... Some historians apply 'Arian' only to the systems of
Arius, Eudoxius, et al. Others apply 'Arian' to any systems except
those of Marcellus, Athanasius, et al. Others introduce straw man
definitions. I suggest something like this:

Different substance
(Aetianism)
(Arianism)
-----------------
Like-ness
Like-substance
(Compromise Positions)
-----------------
Same substance
(Athanasianism)
(Marcellanism)

Both Aetius and Marcellus were mavericks. Philostorgius covers Aetian
church history.

Second, when was the conversion? Were the exiles of 376 mostly pagan
or mostly Christian? If the conversion was late and political, we
have to explain why Theodosius, Arcadius, et al. could never
Catholicize the Goths. (late sixth-century Spain is another story
anyway). If the conversion was early we don't have to explain that.

Third, did the Goths mix ethnic and religious identity politics? I'd
point out Wulfila and Auxentius as semi-Gothic and non-Gothic
Christians who had influence among Gothic Christians.

Fourth, what were their religious views anyway? Given various
persecutions north of the Danube, Wulfila had good reason to keep
working with everyone south of the Danube. Later on, ties with
different-substance schools seem more important (Gaina's revolt, as
well as the 'ni ibna nih galeiks' (sp?) passage in the Skeireins) and
these may have been strong early, or these may have grown from facing
one enemy.


You are a member of the Gothic-L list.  To unsubscribe, send a blank email 
to <gothic-l-unsubscribe at egroups.com>.
Yahoo! Groups Links










You are a member of the Gothic-L list.  To unsubscribe, send a blank email to <gothic-l-unsubscribe at egroups.com>. 
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gothic-l/

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
    gothic-l-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/