Q: 'die', 'dice'

[Alan Dench]

----------------------------Original message----------------------------
Dear Larry,

My intuition was, on reading your message, that the situation
in Australia is much as you describe it for the UK. But I
checked.

What you don't discuss in your Q is the status of the plural
in British English.

My quick straw poll of Australian English speakers up and
down my corridor (non-linguists) yields interesting results.
Unanimous agreement (independently surveyed) that 'dice' is
the singular, and that 'die' is the plural. In case you are wondering,
'die' was offered spontaneously as the plural by all I asked.

So, knowledge of the form 'die' persists but it has been
reanalysed. I'd hazard a guess that this is by analogy to
such recognised wierd plurals as 'octopi' etc.

Best,

Alan Dench
University of Western Australia


Larry Trask wrote:

> ----------------------------Original message----------------------------
> Nothing hangs on this: I'm just curious.  Is my native English becoming
> obsolete in yet another respect?
>
> Traditionally, a spotted cube used in playing certain games is called a
> 'die', with the uniquely irregular plural 'dice'.  This is still, I think,
> the position in American English.  In British English, however, the
> singular 'die' has almost wholly disappeared, and the singular form is now
> 'dice'.
>
> American board games invariably instruct the player to 'throw a die', while
> British games equally invariably instruct the player to 'throw a dice'.
> Most Britons do not even know that 'die' is another word for one of these
> cubes, and most of them are flummoxed when I say something like "throw a
> die", which they find utterly mysterious.  And most Britons do not
> understand the origin of the expression 'the die is cast'.  British
> dictionaries now enter the word under 'dice', and merely cite 'die' as a
> less usual singular form.  Some years ago, I was playing Scrabble with a
> very well-educated British woman, and she played DI, assuming that this
> must be the spelling of the mysterious word she had often heard me use.
>
> However, in the last few years, I've begun to hear 'throw a dice'
> occasionally from Americans -- something which I'm pretty sure I never
> heard when I was growing up in the States.  So, I'm wondering.  Is the
> British usage now becoming established in the States?  Can anybody tell me
> anything about this?  And, while I'm here, what about Canada, Australia,
> the Caribbean, anywhere?  Are we users of 'die' a dying breed?  (Sorry.)
>
> Larry Trask
> COGS
> University of Sussex
> Brighton BN1 9QH
> UK
>
> larryt at cogs.susx.ac.uk
>
> Tel: (01273)-678693 (from UK); +44-1273-678693 (from abroad)
> Fax: (01273)-671320 (from UK); +44-1273-671320 (from abroad)