suggestions anyone?

Thu Nov 25 20:47:23 UTC 2010

Taanshi, Paula and Richard,

This sounds really good!  Especially about the part that WHEN the children
are READY to speak they will!  It is a really natural, stress-free
approach!  No wrong, no right, no stress!  Relaxed learning that is
engaging---great!

Eekoshi.
Heather

On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 1:55 PM, Paula Meyer <pmeyer8 at cox.net> wrote:

>  Richard, just a little answer:  Start with 2nd p plural so they all do
> it.  Native speakers of Kumeyaay like to put the word for "all" with this.
> Later, when you are sure some can do it, switch to 2nd p singular and use
> those students as models.  You could also use the dual with two students in
> between the sing and the pl since it's less threatening to do something with
> a partner; also, it's part of the language.
> Also, when they get ready to SAY where something is, they will.
> Paula
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* Richard Zane Smith <rzs at WILDBLUE.NET>
> *To:* ILAT at LISTSERV.ARIZONA.EDU
> *Sent:* Thursday, November 25, 2010 9:10 AM
> *Subject:* Re: [ILAT] suggestions anyone?
>
> Paula (and ALL of you) thanks!
>
> I've been enjoying the youtube videos of TPR in action
> but i assure you I WILL get the book which sounds excellent.
>
> *wandat* (Wyandot) hasn't had fluent elders in a 100 years
>
> In order for me to implement TPR which in some forms i've accidently done
> already,
> (Though i get most of the kids singing some "vocabulary" from day one)
> I have to "create" the material first.    --from scratch. (((no elders to
> ask,of course)))
> I have to search from our "word lists" and "root/stem lists"
> attempt a construction, send it off via email to a busy linguist
> (who is not paid by our tribe for any work he volunteers)
> wait for up to a week get an "ok" or "a correction" with excellent
> persuasive reasons.
>
> Imperatives have their unique status and problems. Not about
> rudeness...but...
> *raise your hand !*   ...ok....
> should i start with introducing   2p singular? ,   or 2p plural?  ,
> definitely not   2p dual !
>
> or is it better to DROP imperatives all together and start with actions I
> can "join in" ?
> 1p plural inclusive:
> *now, we all raise our hand(s)    we stand  - we sit -  we walk*
> *
> *
> as you can see there's no prepackaged language course for me to simply
> follow
> and its why I appreciate ALL the suggestions given.
>
> After the first day children know when i'm asking "where?" something is
> because I'm using gestures and pretending to look around puzzled.
> ( to get them to respond in wandat will take longer!)
>
> 4 yr old pre-school numbers:  we work up to "twenty"   (they sing it)
>
> K- 5th the kids realize that all the other numbers are "easy"
> once they memorize the foundational "number song".
> they LOVE having me put   (ex)  5432  on the board for them to verbalize..
> but i'm rambling and using your time, have a great thanksgiving!
>
> much to be thankful for!
>
> Richard Zane Smith
> Wyandotte Oklahoma,
>
>
>
> On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 7:54 PM, Paula Meyer <pmeyer8 at cox.net> wrote:
>
>>  Richard, I have used TPR for Kumeyaay, and it has gone over very well
>> and people have learned a lot and liked it.  The lessons are very happy
>> events.  It has to be adapted culturally, e.g. direct commands are
>> considered rude in a lot of languages and the vocabulary is not always
>> appropriate, but this is easily changed.  You have to teach and
>> practice it with the teachers.  If you get Asher's basic book Learning
>> another language through actions (www.tpr-world.com), you can adapt it,
>> and the teachers can do it once they understand the concept.  We practice
>> before each lesson.  You might want to look at TPR Storytelling too, another
>> of Asher's books. .Since you are dealing with preschoolers, they probably
>> don't need all of this; in my experience, they get bored with the structure
>> and need a more natural situation.  However, it may give your teachers
>> something to hold onto that's a language-teaching "method," and they might
>> feel more secure.  If your teachers are into "research," there are tons of
>> it to support not changing back and forth between languages, especially with
>> the majority language.  I hate to keep beating this horse, but do you have
>> any videos of language nests?  They could look at those if they can't visit
>> one, because preschoolers are such little sponges in any language, and
>> seeing it in action might help them get rid of the majority language in
>> their interactions with the children.  Good luck.  Your efforts will be
>> rewarded when you hear those little kids talking to each other in their
>> heritage language.
>> Paula
>>
>>  ----- Original Message -----
>> *From:* Richard Zane Smith <rzs at WILDBLUE.NET>
>> *To:* ILAT at LISTSERV.ARIZONA.EDU
>>  *Sent:* Wednesday, November 24, 2010 4:29 PM
>> *Subject:* Re: [ILAT] suggestions anyone?
>>
>>  thanks Dorothy,
>> I have been hearing reference to TPR in some seminars I've attended
>> but haven't seen anything indepth. I'll look into it
>> I do use my body alot while i'm teaching and gestues,
>> which is how we all learned our first language (without translations!)
>>
>>  i also use puppets animals who "talk" ,so i can model conversations
>> between myself and puppets...which ALSO means
>> there becomes more than one Language Speaker in the room!
>>
>> its nice to hear the advice
>> and to simply be able to talk with people who know its value!
>>
>>  tizhameh (thanks)
>> Richard
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 1:18 PM, <Dmark916 at aol.com> wrote:
>>
>>>  Richard, what you are doing invites a special legacy for the people,
>>> and even though it may not seem to be valued, it lights a way for language
>>> to flourish. Many years ago (like the 1970's) Berty Seigle developed a
>>> technique call Total Physical Response (TPR). As you are exposing very young
>>> children to language, please consider using her approach, as it involves
>>> movement and action in language learning. Gradually the children anticipate
>>> the language and begin using it themselves, not in a word-by-word context,
>>> but actually in descriptive ways. There is no "translation" necessary. And
>>> the teachers, looking on or looking in, can become involved as well.
>>> While some teacher inservice workshops might be helpful, without
>>> administrative backing they might just be resented. Try the TPR approach (or
>>> some iteration of it) instead.
>>> In Spirit,
>>> Dorothy Martinez-K
>>>
>>>  In a message dated 11/24/2010 6:41:34 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,
>>> rzs at WILDBLUE.NET writes:
>>>
>>> thanks Doug and Natasha,
>>> good way to explain it about not "giving away the answer" in class.
>>> the books (Natasha) sounds excellent...another project! for me to look
>>> into.
>>> (sounds like i need to have some meetings with these teachers)
>>>
>>> Its tough because ...sadly: *I'm it*. I'm our local language
>>> revitalization effort,
>>> which is foolish and even ridiculous. there is no language committee in
>>> our tribe
>>> and if anythings going to happen its because I'm insane enough to
>>> volunteer to
>>> attempt it on my own....and this is the 6th year of me  ..."doing it
>>> alone"
>>>
>>> You all who have healthy language/culture revitalization efforts
>>> Have something to thank the Creator for.
>>> Just don't forget about some of us foolish ones, winging it alone,
>>> carrying the whole weight but determined not to give up..even if it kills
>>> us.
>>>
>>> 'preciate having some pros to bounce ideas upon here on ILAT!
>>> ske;noh
>>> Richard
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 2:17 AM, Natasha L Warner <nwarner at u.arizona.edu
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>> I think Leanne Hinton's book that's actually a guide to the Master
>>>> Apprentice program, _How to Keep your Language Alive_, has some good
>>>> explanations of why immersion without translation is the way to go.
>>>>  Maybe
>>>> something in that would help you with how to explain it to the teachers.
>>>> It's a challenging issue--even people who really know better about
>>>> immersion so often want to just "help" by providing translation.  Good
>>>> luck.
>>>>
>>>> Natasha
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *******************************************************************************
>>>> Natasha Warner
>>>> Associate Professor, Department of Linguistics
>>>> University of Arizona
>>>> PO Box 210028
>>>> Tucson, AZ 85721-0028
>>>> U.S.A.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> *
>>>
>>> "It is easier to build strong children than to repair broken men."
>>>
>>> - Frederick Douglass
>>> *
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> *
>>
>> "It is easier to build strong children than to repair broken men."
>>
>> - Frederick Douglass
>> *
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> *
>
> "those who desire to give up freedom in order to gain security will not
> have,nor do they deserve,either one." Benjamin Franklin
>
>  "its easier to build strong children than repair broken men" Frederick
> Douglas
>
>
> "It is easier to build strong children than to repair broken men"
>
> - Frederick Douglass
>
>   *
>
>
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