[Lexicog] indeclinable def.

[David Frank]

I will throw in my two cents worth, which is another way of saying what David Tuggy has already said.

Some languages like English have different forms of the pronouns, based on whether it is a subject (I) or object (me), or used as a possessive pronoun (my). There are sometimes other forms, too, like the reflexive (myself). These are the different declensions of the pronoun. Other languages don't have different forms of the pronouns for these different purposes. Then you would say that the pronouns are not declined.

For example, in St. Lucian Creole, there is only one form of the first person pronoun, regardless of whether it is used as a subject, an object or a possessive. Here are some examples:

Mwen vini.  "I came."
David bat mwen.  "David hit me."
Manman mwen malad.  "My mother is sick."

So you could call the St. Lucian Creole word 'mwen' an indeclinable personal pronoun. However, we wouldn't have bothered calling it that, because in St. Lucian Creole, basically nothing is declined, so there is no expectation that the pronouns should be declined. However, if you are comparing St. Lucian (French) Creole with English or with standard French, then you might point out that in St. Lucian Creole the pronouns are not declined (for the most part).

I understand that Old English had different declensions for all nouns, depending on how they were used in a sentence, but over time that case system for nouns was lost, and it only survives on the pronouns in modern English.

-- David Frank


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "phil cash cash" <pasxapu at DAKOTACOM.NET>
To: <lexicographylist at yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 4:44 PM
Subject: Re: [Lexicog] indeclinable def.


David, yes, I think it is beginning to makes sense.  So I imagine  
(from a strictly Eng perspective) that one can make use of an  
indeclinable form when someone says things like "Me, myself, and I  
left town" where "Me, myself and I" taken together is an indeclinable- 
like expression.  If so, then I am thinking something like "I myself"  
is an independent indeclinable ponoun in the languages I'm familiar  
with (though Eng uses the two words here).
Phil

On Jul 16, 2008, at 12:56 PM, David Tuggy wrote:

> Presumably one would use the term only in a language where nouns  
> and other nominal entities (like pronouns) are usually declined  
> (i.e. have different "case" forms according to their grammatical  
> function.) Personal pronouns would be either pronouns referring to  
> human beings (persons) or to "grammatical person", i.e. 1st, 2nd,  
> and 3rd person pronouns. In English the 1st person singular pronoun  
> can be described as a declinable form (though in English we don't  
> do declensions as a rule) since it can be I, me, or my according to  
> its grammatical function. If the 2nd person singular pronoun didn't  
> have a special possessive form (your), it would be an indeclinable  
> personal pronoun, since it appears as you in all (other) syntactic  
> contexts.
>
> Does that make sense?
>
> --David T
>
> phil cash cash wrote:
>>
>> Greetings, I need to find a basic but informative definition for a  
>> grammatical category: indeclinable personal pronoun. Any  
>> suggestions appreciated, Phil 

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lexicographylist/

<*> Your email settings:
    Individual Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lexicographylist/join
    (Yahoo! ID required)

<*> To change settings via email:
    mailto:lexicographylist-digest at yahoogroups.com 
    mailto:lexicographylist-fullfeatured at yahoogroups.com

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
    lexicographylist-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/