Does music technically qualify as a language?

Thu May 12 22:10:05 UTC 2011

David Lidov's "Is Language A Music?" (Indiana UP 2004) turns many of these questions on their heads in productive ways.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Harriet J. Ottenheimer" <mahafan at ksu.edu>
Date: Thursday, May 12, 2011 2:36 pm
Subject: Re: Does music technically qualify as a language?
To: LINGANTH at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG

> And, just to complicate the issue a bit, there is also Steven MIthen's 
> 
> 2005 /The Singing Neanderthals: the Origins of Music, Language, Mind 
> and 
> Body/ Cambridge, Mass.: Harvard University Press, which explores the 
> potential role of music-making in language origins.  --Harriet Ottenheimer
> 
> On 5/12/2011 1:59 PM, Jim Wilce wrote:
> > On this issue I would also recommend the work of ethnomusicologist 
> > Elizabeth Tolbert:
> >
> > Tolbert, Elizabeth
> >     2001    Voice, Metaphysics and Community. In Pain and its 
> > Transformations. S. Coakley and K. Shelemay, eds. Cambridge, Mass.
> > —
> >     2001    Music and Meaning: An Evolutionary Story. Psychology of 
> 
> > Music 29(1):84-94.
> > —
> >     1992    Theories of Meaning and Music Cognition: An 
> > Ethnomusicological Approach. The World of Music 34(3):7–21.
> > —
> >     2001    The Enigma of Music, the Voice of Reason: “Music,” 
> > “Language,” and Becoming Human. New Literary History 32:451–465.
> >
> > Jim Wilce
> >
> >
> > On 5/12/11 8:26 AM, Steve Black wrote:
> >> Dear Scott and Glenn,
> >> I think one of the best places where an anthropological perspective 
> 
> >> on these issues is addressed is in Steven Feld and Aaron Fox's 1994 
> 
> >> piece, "Music and Language," in Annual Review of Anthropology. One 
> of 
> >> their points in there is that from the "music as language" 
> >> perspective, music is semantically more opaque and syntactically 
> more 
> >> redundant. You can't say, "I need to go to the store to get some 
> >> bread," through music, unless you know how to do this with a 
> talking 
> >> drum or you add lyrics to the music. And the rhythm, harmony, and 
> >> melody of most music is much more repetitive than any other form of 
> 
> >> communication.
> >>
> >> Of course, if you shift your focus from a formalist perspective to 
> an 
> >> ethnographic and communicatively oriented one, then you start to 
> see 
> >> many more shared features, and to really understand how it is that 
> 
> >> music communicates emotion. I myself have found great value in 
> >> viewing both music and language as types of communication that 
> >> differentially utilize the full breadth of semiotic modalities 
> >> available to humans (syntax, prosody, stress, volume, but also 
> >> gesture, facial expression, body orientation, the physical 
> >> environment) [This semiotic modalities perspective comes from the 
> >> work of Charles and Marjorie Goodwin]. I wrote a little about this 
> in 
> >> a recent Anthro News article, in January 2011, "The Body in Sung 
> >> Performance." But there is a wealth of important literature 
> >> discussing the music language connection, especially from an 
> >> ethnographic standpoint. Two of my favorite recent contributions 
> are 
> >> Aaron Fox's book, "Real Country: Music and Language in Working 
> Class 
> >> Culture," and David Samuels' book, "Putting a Song on Top of It: 
> >> Expression and Identity on the San Carlos Apache Reservation."
> >>
> >> Best,
> >> Steve Black
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On May 12, 2011, at 7:14 AM, Scott F. Kiesling wrote:
> >>
> >>> Colleagues:
> >>>
> >>> I received this query and thought some of you musically minded folks
> >>> might be able to help (or any of you really). Please reply to Mr.
> >>> Rudolph and not to me. Of course, discussion on the list might be
> >>> interesting too.
> >>>
> >>> SFK
> >>>
> >>> ----- Forwarded message from "Glenn L. 
> >>> Rudolph"<glrudolph at verizon.net>  -----
> >>>
> >>>> From: "Glenn L. Rudolph"<glrudolph at verizon.net>
> >>>> Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 12:40:04 -0400
> >>>> To: "Kiesling, Scott F"<kiesling at pitt.edu>
> >>>> Subject: Does music technically qualify as a language?
> >>>> Good Afternoon Dr. Kiesling,
> >>>> Please bear with me for a bit - I write you as a composer seeking 
> 
> >>>> advice and information from a linguist. I hope you don't mind my 
> 
> >>>> contacting you - I pulled your email address from the PITT 
> >>>> Linguistics Department website.
> >>>> I very recently (last week) received my Masters Degree in Music 
> >>>> Composition from Duquesne. Other than composition, a major 
> interest 
> >>>> of mine is music's ability to communicate meaning and emotion. 
> >>>> Essentially, the question I'm exploring is (speaking of 
> classical, 
> >>>> or art music) "why is it that when I hear contemporary 
> (20th/21st) 
> >>>> century compositions for instance, some pieces I 'get' and others 
> I 
> >>>> do not?" A very different question from whether I like the work 
> or 
> >>>> not. I might understand a piece musically, but not particularly 
> >>>> like it, while others I simply don't understand. My intent here 
> is 
> >>>> to formulate a theory that answers the question and submit it to 
> 
> >>>> one of the various music theory journals.
> >>>> My gut feeling is that I simply don't understand the composer's 
> >>>> musical language - the musical vocabulary, syntax, and grammar 
> that 
> >>>> the composer employs - which presupposes that music is a language 
> 
> >>>> of some sort. Volumes have been written about music and meaning 
> and 
> >>>> music as a language which I have been reading for the past year 
> or 
> >>>> so. Some of the arguments presented against music qualifying as a 
> 
> >>>> true language is it's lack of key features that languages 
> possess, 
> >>>> such as the ability to indicate past tense or possessive case. My 
> 
> >>>> initial, uneducated reaction to these arguments was that I wasn't 
> 
> >>>> sure all languages have the ability to indicate past tense or 
> >>>> possessive case.
> >>>> So my questions for you are:
> >>>> *
> >>>> linguistically, is there a list of qualities or mechanics that a 
> 
> >>>> system must possess, at a minimum, in order to qualify as  language
> >>>> *
> >>>> knowing what you now do about my area of interest, can you 
> >>>> recommend resources that would be helpful in giving me a basic 
> >>>> understanding of the branch of linguistics appropriate to this 
> >>>> endeavor?
> >>>> *
> >>>> is there presently a graduate student in your program who might 
> be 
> >>>> interested in collaborating on and co-authoring this project?
> >>>> Thanks so much for your time and attention,
> >>>> Glenn L. Rudolph
> >>>> 298 Cottingham Place
> >>>> Cranberry Twp., PA 16066
> >>>> Phone: 724.453.0683
> >>>> Email: glenn at reindeermusic.com
> >>>> Website: www.reindeermusic.com
> >>> ----- End forwarded message -----
> >>>
> >>> -- 
> >>> Scott F. Kiesling, PhD
> >>>
> >>> Associate Professor
> >>> Department of Linguistics
> >>> University of Pittsburgh, 2816 CL
> >>> Pittsburgh, PA 15260
> >>> http://www.linguistics.pitt.edu
> >>> Office: +1 412-624-5916
> >> “Natural science gives us an answer to the question of what we must 
> 
> >> do if we wish to master life technically, but it leaves quite 
> aside… 
> >> whether we should and do wish to master life technically and 
> whether 
> >> it ultimately makes sense to do so” --Max Weber
> >>
> >> "Yesterday is history. Tomorrow is a mystery. And today? Today is a 
> 
> >> gift. That's why we call it the present." --Babatunde Olatunji
> >> .
> >>
> >
> >
> 
> -- 
> 
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