'impersonal' second person

[Nick Thieberger]

This use of second person for impersonal reference is also found in
South Efate (Oceanic, Vanuatu), as in the following examples of its
use as S and O and as a directly possessed non (npau-m, 'your head' =
'one's head').

Impersonal reference, as in ‘You’d like to think that...’ or ‘They say
that...’ can
also, as in English, be encoded by second singular and third singular forms in
South Efate. So in (1) the subject is a 2sg form, but the reference is to a
generic subject. The direct possessive form in this example, npaum ‘your head’
also has generic reference here (‘one’s head’).
1 Selwan ku=min nai kokon nen i=preg
when 2sgRS=drink water bitter that 3sg-RS=make

npau-m i=fif.
head- 2sgDP 3sgRS=spin
When you drink that bitter water it makes your head spin/When one drinks
that bitter water it makes one’s head spin. (017:64)

The impersonal object in (2) is encoded by the 2sgO suffix (-k).
2 Ru=f tae tilusus-i-k ko ru=f til-ki-k, ko.
3p.RS=CND know tell.off-TS-2sgO or 3p.RS=CND tell-TR-2sgO or
They could tell you off, or they might talk to you, or something. (98009a,
452.08, 468.84)

A non-referential subject, or one that refers to a whole proposition rather
than to a single participant in it, as in the general statement ‘It’s good’ in
English, is similarly encoded by a 3sg pronoun in South Efate. In (3) the 3sg
subject is used for the generic statement, ‘today it is the same’.
3 Mes i=pitkaskei, naflak ru=ta tme-r taulu-e-r.
today 3sgRS=be.same clan 3p.RS=DUR RR-3p.DP marry-V-3p.O
Today it is the same, the clans still marry each other. (98010a,
1362.81, 1364.85)

In (4) the speaker is talking about how close a relative can be to be a
suitable marriage partner. The anaphoric referent of the 3sg subject
of wi ‘to be
good’ is the whole preceding proposition, ‘if the relationship is distant’.
4 Me i=f wel i=nrus pi emae, go i=wi,
but 3sgRS=CND thus 3sgRS=just be far and 3sgRS=good

me i=welkin meltig top, rak=fo kano trok.
but 3sgRS=thus close much 3d.IRR=PSP:IR unable agree
But if it (the relationship) is distant, it is good, but if it is too
close, they
won’t be able to agree. (98009a, 1381.22, 1386.84)


Nick


*****************************************************************************************************************
Nick Thieberger PhD
ARC QEII Fellow
School of Languages and Linguistics
The University of Melbourne
Parkville, VIC 3010, Australia
+61 3 8344 8952
http://www.linguistics.unimelb.edu.au/thieberger/
*****************************************************************************************************************

On 27 September 2011 06:39, Denis Creissels
<Denis.Creissels at univ-lyon2.fr> wrote:
> Dear Eitan,
>
>
>
> Last week we had a workshop in Paris on impersonal pronouns, and I presented
> a paper available to dowload at the following link :
>
>
>
> http://deniscreissels.fr/admin/plugin.php?p=pages&act=page&id=5&upd=1
>
>
>
> The first part of this paper, devoted to the coreference properties of
> French ‘on’, is not directly relevant to your point, but the second part
> deals with the coreference properties of the second person singular pronoun
> of Mandinka (a Mande language spoken in Senegal, The Gambia, and Guinea
> Bissau) in its impersonal use.
>
>
>
> More generally, impersonal uses of second person singular pronouns quite
> similar to those found in European languages are very common in Subsaharan
> Africa. But in addition to that, in some West African languages at least,
> second person pronouns used impersonally may have more ‘exotic’ coreference
> properties, as shown in my paper.
>
>
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Denis
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> De : Discussion List for ALT [mailto:LINGTYP at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG] De
> la part de Eitan Grossman
> Envoyé : lundi 26 septembre 2011 17:54
> À : LINGTYP at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG
> Objet : 'impersonal' second person
>
>
>
> Hi everyone,
>
>
>
> I'm interested in uses of second person for 'generic,' 'impersonal,' or
> 'procedural' functions, e.g., 'you go straight and then left,' 'you never
> know what you're up against,' etc. Anna Siewierska (Person, p. 212) mentions
> that it occurs in Germanic, Romance, Slavonic languages, as well as
> Hungarian, Estonian, Komi, Turkish, Abkhaz, and another dozen or so
> non-European languages.
>
>
>
> At the moment, I'm interested in the cross-linguistic extent of this
> phenomenon. I would be grateful if people would be able to tell me in what
> languages it does (or doesn't) occur. If there are any linguistic
> discussions of this in particular languages or families, that would be great
> too.
>
>
>
> I will post a summary of the responses, if there are any.
>
>
>
> Thanks!
>
>
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Eitan Grossman
>
>
>
>