query: taboo against 3 people in picture

Mon Feb 27 10:01:51 UTC 2012

Dear David,

from Ambrym, Vanuatu, I have several photos with exactly three people
in them and it didn't seem to bother anyone. Otherwise, the languages
I have been working on there and their speakers have share a couple of
features with what you've described for the "Mekong-Mamberamo" area,
such as dental clicks for expressions of amazement, "where are you
going" as conventional greeting, verby adjectives and SVO order.

Best,
Kilu

On Mon, Feb 27, 2012 at 9:58 AM, tasaku tsunoda <tsunoda at ninjal.ac.jp> wrote:
>
>
> From: ISHIZUKA Masayuki <noitartsinimda at gmail.com>
> Reply-To: <altjapan at googlegroups.com>
> Date: Thu, 23 Feb 2012 22:37:43 +0900
> To: <altjapan at googlegroups.com>
> Subject: Re: [ALT Japan: 1165] RE?: SV: query: taboo against 3 people in
> picture
>
> Dear David
>
> I'm from Japan and I've heard of the taboo from elderly people.
> They said the middle person between the other two should die before long.
>
> One can explain the taboo as follows:
> At least in my country, when more than two people are to be taken a
> picture,
> it is a person of the highest rank that will occupy the middle position.
> And then s/he tend to be much older than the others, so to die soonest.
>
> Masayuki
>
> On 2012/02/23, at 9:22, tasaku tsunoda wrote:
>
>
>
> From: "Hewitt, Stephen" <s.hewitt at UNESCO.ORG>
> Reply-To: "Hewitt, Stephen" <s.hewitt at UNESCO.ORG>
> Date: Wed, 22 Feb 2012 17:51:52 +0100
> To: <LINGTYP at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG>
> Subject: RE : SV: query: taboo against 3 people in picture
>
> It's the same as the English saying "one's lonely, two's company, three's a
> crowd"
>
> Steve Hewitt
>
>
> -------- Message d'origine--------
> De: Discussion List for ALT de la part de Pedro Martins
> Date: mer. 22/02/2012 15:26
> À: LINGTYP at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG
> Objet : Re: SV: query: taboo against 3 people in picture
>
> In Portuguese (at least, in European Portuguese), there's the expression:
> "um é pouco, dois é bom, três é demais", which means "one is too few, two
> is good, three is too much". It is regularly used when a situation arises
> in which the norm is exactly two persons (being in a couple, for example)
> and a third person wants to -- or finds himself in a position that make
> others think he might -- be part of it.
>
> Pedro
>
> On Wed, Feb 22, 2012 at 13:36, <vfriedm at uchicago.edu> wrote:
>
>> Consider also the taboo against three on a match (for lighting
>> cigarettes).
>> I have heard that the belief dates from WWI trench warfare.  The
>> explanation was that by the time the third person had lit up, the enemy
>> had
>> time to aim and fire.
>> But the taboo itself was well known when i was in college.
>> Victor
>>
>> ---- Original message ----
>> >Date: Wed, 22 Feb 2012 21:37:25 +0900
>> >From: Discussion List for ALT <LINGTYP at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG> (on
>> behalf of David Gil <gil at EVA.MPG.DE>)
>> >Subject: Re: SV: query: taboo against 3 people in picture
>> >To: LINGTYP at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG
>> >
>> >Jan,
>> >
>> >Yes, even Indonesian has similar expressions.  However, in the case of
>> >'three is a crowd' and such, I think the implicature is clearly that
>> >four (and above) would be even worse, whereas in the case of the
>> >3-people-in-picture taboo, a common way of solving the problem is to
>> >invite an additional person into the picture -- the taboo is
>> >specifically for three.
>> >
>> >David
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >> Dear David,
>> >>
>> >> Hailing from a different part of the world, your query made me think of
>> such phrases as 'Three is a crowd' and 'Ménage á trois', which suggest
>> that
>> three is one too many.
>> >>
>> >> Best,
>> >>
>> >> Jan
>> >>
>> >> -----Ursprungligt meddelande-----
>> >> Från: Discussion List for ALT
>> >> [mailto:LINGTYP at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG]
>> För David Gil
>> >> Skickat: den 22 februari 2012 13:14
>> >> Till: LINGTYP at LISTSERV.LINGUISTLIST.ORG
>> >> Ämne: query: taboo against 3 people in picture
>> >>
>> >> Dear all,
>> >>
>> >> Apologies for posting a non-linguistic query, but I'm interested in
>> checking whether the non-linguistic feature in question correlates with a
>> particular linguistic area, so perhaps all you field linguists out there
>> can contribute some of your experiences.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> In many parts of mainland and insular Southeast Asia stretching into
>> New Guinea, there is a taboo against three people posing for a photo.  One
>> or two is fine, four, five and up is fine, but three is a no no.  In some
>> places the taboo is strong, while in others it's just something people
>> joke
>> about.  Sometimes it is said that the person in the middle will meet
>> misfortune or die.
>> >>
>> >> I have encountered this taboo in Cambodia, Sumatra, Borneo, Palawan,
>> Luzon, Sulawesi, Maluku, and on a recent trip to the Baliem Valley in the
>> Papuan highlands.  (Though not in Java or the lesser Sunda isles.) The
>> areal distribution suggests that the taboo must be older than the advent
>> of
>> photography, perhaps extending back to drawings and paintings; the
>> antiquity of the taboo is further supported by its presence amongst the
>> Papuan highland Dani, whose first contact with the outside world was only
>> in the 1940s (and it seems implausible that they would have picked up the
>> taboo since then).
>> >>
>> >> My question is: where else is such a taboo present?  Are you familiar
>> >> with it from any other parts of the world?   I would greatly appreciate
>> >> both positive and negative data (the latter always being harder to
>> obtain reliably).  I am particularly interested in delimiting the extent
>> of
>> the area listed above:  does the taboo exist further east in New Guinea
>> and
>> into the Pacific?  What about north into China, or west into South Asia?
>> >>
>> >> Thanks,
>> >>
>> >> David
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> David Gil
>> >>
>> >> Department of Linguistics
>> >> Max Planck Institute for Evolutionary Anthropology Deutscher Platz 6,
>> D-04103 Leipzig, Germany
>> >>
>> >> Telephone: 49-341-3550321 Fax: 49-341-3550119
>> >> Email: gil at eva.mpg.de
>> >> Webpage:  http://www.eva.mpg.de/~gil/
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >--
>> >David Gil
>> >
>> >Department of Linguistics
>> >Max Planck Institute for Evolutionary Anthropology
>> >Deutscher Platz 6, D-04103 Leipzig, Germany
>> >
>> >Telephone: 49-341-3550321 Fax: 49-341-3550119
>> >Email: gil at eva.mpg.de
>> >Webpage:  http://www.eva.mpg.de/~gil/
>>
>
>
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