LL-L: "Language varieties" LOWLANDS-L, 12.AUG.2000 (01) [E]

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  L O W L A N D S - L * 12.AUG.2000 (01) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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From: Alfred Brothers [alfredb at erols.com]
Subject: LL-L: "Language varieties" LOWLANDS-L, 10.AUG.2000 (03) [E]

John Feather asked:

> Some questions about American English.
>
> 2. In Standard BE we pronounce "the" differently before vowels and
> consonants. We pronounce "the elephant" as "theeyelephant" - the
intensity
> of the "y" sound depending on the speaker. Americans tend to say "th@
> elephant", the length of the pause again depending on the speaker. Do I
have
> this right? Are there regional and social differences?

In contrast to Stefan Israel's response, in New England we also pronounce
"the"
differently depending on whether the following word begins with a vowel or
consonant. It's "th@ book" but "thee(y)elephant" and "thee(y)apple".
Interestingly, if we are stressing "the" before a vowel, the "y"-glide is
often
reduced or is replaced by a glottal stop or hiatus. However, I clearly hear
many
Americans link the two words as Stefan describes, often to the point that
-- to
my ears -- the vowel of "the" almost disappears, giving "th'elephant,
th'apple".
Which brings me to "to Italy":  To me it seems that many Americans link
this
preposition in the same way as "the". In New England, however, most
speakers say
"he wants t@ speak t@ me" but "they tried too open it too everyone" (=
"...to
open it to everyone") and not "...t@ open it t@ everyone". I'm not sure
that
these pronunciations are limited to New England. I believe they're common
as far
south as New York or New Jersey. But I do know they're not common in the
mid-Atlantic or southern coastal regions.

> 3. Has anybody ever tried to explain consonant shifts such as those in
> Robert Mitchum's (I think in "Wings of War") "Naddlies gone tiddly"

Again I agree for the most part with Stefan's comments; however, in
addition to
the writes/rides example, I hear a distinct difference between
writer/rider,
writing/riding, whiter/wider (assuming it's a speaker who doesn't
distinguish w
from wh), waiter/wader, even looter/lewder. The vowel or diphthong before
"t"
(in my speech, and I think in the speech of most others) retains the
shorter
quality of a vowel or diphthong before a voiceless consonant, even though
the
"t" has become (semi-)voiced**, i.e, the same as in "price/prize" and
"races/raises". True, the difference is almost imperceptable or totally
non-existent, in latter/ladder, betting/bedding, "little" rhyming with
"middle"
--  I suppose because of the short vowel sound.

** It's not really voiced to a /d/; Stefan's example of a single-flapped r
describes the sound exactly.

By the way, does this "voicing" occur in any British English or Scots
dialects?
It seems to me I've heard Scots English spoken with this sound, but it
could
have been by Americans putting on an not-too-good accent. How about Low
Saxon or
Dutch? I seem to remember seeing things like "zidden/sidden" (for
"zitten/sitten"), but I'd probably never locate them again. Oh yeah, it
must
happen -- isn't "Hamborg an de Waterkant" usually pronounced "...Wodakant"?
Or
is that just a poor imitation, too?

Alfred Brothers

----------

From: john feather [johnfeather at sceptic1.freeserve.co.uk]
Subject: Language varieties

In the library I found a copy of Collins Cobuild "English Usage: Helping
learners with _real_ English". After reading a book like this it seems
quite
amazing that we can  form any correct sentences in English!

Under "fit" it gives two distinct usages in AmE:

"The pants fit him well and looked like men's slacks."

"He fitted his key into the lock."

I am puzzled by Stefan's assertion that "AmE petal and Scots pearl come out
sounding the same". Do Scots agree?

John Feather johnfeather at sceptic1.freeserve.co.uk

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