LL-L: "Language varieties" (was "Resources") 02.JUL.2000 (02) [D/E]

Sun Jul 2 19:17:09 UTC 2000

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 L O W L A N D S - L * 02.JUL.2000 (02) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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From: Roger Thijs [Roger.Thijs at village.uunet.be]
Subject: Limburgish, was:  "Resources" 01.JUL.2000 (02) [D/E/L/French]

> From: Roger Thijs [Roger.Thijs at village.uunet.be]
> Subject: Reference material
> 4. This week I got the summer issue of "Oos Platt" from the Arbeitskreis
> Mundart (Kreis Heinsberg) > A sample in Selfkant Platt, quote from p.
3-4:
> Maar Moot! (Franz Franzen)

> Reinhard/Ron:
> There are some very un-Saxon elements, such as occasional k>ch (e.g.,
> _och_, _dech_; cf. Northern Saxon  _ook_, _die_/Eastphalian _dik_ ~
_dek_),

Does this refer to:
> ...on schaam dech net! ?
Dutch: ".. en schaam je/u niet"
While the "ich" form is typical for Limburgisch (as a matter of fact the
Ich-isogloss is used for fixing the "linguistic territory"), the "dich"
form, often also used as nominative, only starts appearing in the mid of
Belgian Limburg. In the West we use the (old) plural with "dzji-ë"
(Brabant: "gij") as wel for singular as for plural.

For a detailled analysis, cf.:
Stevens, Pronominale Isomorphen in Belgisch-Limburg, I; pp 132-154 in Taal
en Tongval 1949

Ook/Ooch has very strange isoglosses: The ooch isogloss follows rougly the
Ik/ich isogloss i the West, but there is an __island of "ook"__ around
Tongeren. In my Limburgish, not too far from Tongeren, we used ók, but I
think this is a-typical Limburgish.
A loose leaf isoglos map for ook/ooch is joined to the book for the course
"Ich kal ooch Limburgs", published by the Provincial Government of Belgian
Limburg.

In my Limburgish I would use "dèk" for "döck" in the Selfkant text:
> Kall dräm Platt, sue döcks et jeht!
Dutch: Spreek daarom dialect, zo dikwijls als het gaat.
Limburgish (Vliermaal): Kal dóveur plat, zoe dèk as het gèt
(It's curious we use the verb "go", cf. French: "Comment ça va?")

> t>sch (_heescht_, cf. NS _heett_),
In West-Limburgish it is still "heet"
In the Maas river valley it's already "heisje" for "heten".
(cf. Prikken, de taal van de Maas, Woordenboek Nederlands-Limburgs)

> and there are atypical vowel situations
> (e.g., _örm_, _versteht_, _jeht_, _Värke_, _störve_, _örve_, cf. NS
_arm_,
> _verstait_, _gait_, _Farken_, _starven_, _arven_).

The g to j transformation is typical Ripuarish, but also occuring in
East-Limburgish:
> Jecke
Dutch: gekken
> jeht
Dutch: gaat

_örm_, _versteht_, _jeht_, _Värke_, _störve_, _örve_,
 cf. NS _arm_,> _verstait_, _gait_, _Farken_, _starven_, _arven

In my West-Limburgish:
erm, versteut, gèt, verke, sterve, erve
Dutch: arm, verstaat, gaat, varken (zwijn), sterven, erven.

For the Dutch "everzwijn" we say "wild verreke" in my Limburgish.

> atypical vowel situations
In the area I come from (Vliermaal) _each_ municipality has it's own vowel
shifts. I guess the combination of the spread of the isoglosses in the West

(cf. the so-called "Rheinische Fächer), the presence of the Romance
linguistic border at just a few miles (enentually responsible for the
nasalized vowels), the territorial division during the "ancien régime", the

formerly socially closed communities in the past, may all explain.

BTW: Heinsberg shared a large part of it's history with the County of Loon,

the latter vitually coïnciding with the actual Belgian Limburg.
Quoting below from some old documents: curiously, when Latin started to be
replaced by the people's languages, one didn't write in the municipal
dialect, but in some kind of koinés (that emerged from __nowhere__?):
- old French (only incidentally walloon)
- (Brabantish) Dutch (and not Limburgish)
Brabant most probably  (???) got it's influence after it defeated the
bisschop of Cologne in Worringen, and by that, gained the Duchy of Limburg
and the Overmaas territories. It's "Dutch" penetrated deep into the
Rhineland area as written koiné, but, especially since the middle of the
18th century, it was systematically replaced with Hochdeutsch by the
Prussians.

Back to Loon-Heinsberg, quoting from some documents from Wolters, Codex
diplomaticus Lossensis, Ghent, 1849:

p. 287 (anno 1339): Wi Didderic, greve van __Loen__ ende van Ciney, here
van __Heinsberch__ ende van Blanckenberch...
p. 293 (anno 1340): Nos Theodoricus, __Lossensis__ et Chinacensis comes,
dominus de __Hennesperch__ et de Blankenberg, ac Kunegundis, ipsius dominus

comitis contoralis,...
p. 297 (anno 1340): Nous Thiris, cuens de __Looz__ et de Chinyt, sires de
__Henseberg__ et de Blankenberch...

Dutch: the town: "Borgloon", the (former) county: "Graafschap Loon"
French: Looz
Limburgish: Lown

In the 16th - 18th centuries the territories East of the river Maas have
been re-divided several times as parts of the Branbantish Overmaas
territories, of Gelre, or of  Gullik-Jülich-Juliers (several re-divisions
and exchanges between The Republic, The Spanish/Austrian Netherlands and
Prussia)

The French organised the area in two departments "Meuse-Inférieure" and
"Roer", but when the "Meuse Inférieure" became "Limburg" in 1814, the
boundaries were changed several times in the first years.
Neyens, "De Staatkundige geschiedenis der Provincie Limburg vanaf haar
ontstaan tot aan haar uiteenvallen in 1839" ( Maastricht 1956, 192 pp with
large size atlas) has 12 different territorial maps for the period
1814-1839.
The town of Heinsberg itself was Limburgish from Sept. 12 1814 till May 12,

1815.

In 1946 The Netherlands annexed part of this territory (Tüddern). It was
returned to Germany on August 1, 1963
(pp. 1078-1080 in Onze Jaren 45-70, Amsterdam Boek B.V.)

--

Regarding the url leading to a text about Maansland-Limburgish:

The text does not discus the __tonality__ issue. As a matter of fact, we
Limburgians are not aware of it, and it is quite difficult for us to
realize we can hardly speak Dutch free of our Limburgish musicality.

I found a technical definition in:
L. Grootaers en J. Grauls, Klankleer van het Hasseltsch dialect, 1930,
Koninklijke Vlaamsche Academie voor Taal- en Letterkunde,
quote p. 133 (in Dutch, in de Vries orthography):
In opzicht van van toonhoogte bestaat er een klaar onderscheid tusschen
sleeptoon en stoottoon. De __sleeptonige__ lettergrepen hebben een
__stijgend__ muzikaal accent. Zooals in het Tongersch bedraagt de
doorloopen afstand ongeveer een __terts minor__...
De stoottonige lettergrepen hebben dezelfde muzikale betoning als in het
Tongersch: er ligt een __quarte minor__ (__dalend__) tusschen begin en
einde.
(Hasselt and Tongeren are two towns in Belgian Limburg)

Regards,

Roger

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