LL-L: "Romance connection" LOWLANDS-L, 05.MAY.2000 (05) [E]

Fri May 5 15:36:39 UTC 2000

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From: UB82DN at aol.com
Subject: LL-L: "Romance connection" LOWLANDS-L, 04.MAY.2000 (09) [E]

Liewe Laaglanders,
    "Schisslong" reminds me of that piece of furniture in the American South
which we call a "shiffero."  I thought it was a completely made-up word until
I learned that the manufacturers had apparently coined the word "chifferobe"
out of chiffonier and wardrobe.  So it was "made up" - but a little more
systematically than I had thought.

Cheers,
Joe Stromberg

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From: Matthew McGrattan [matthew.mcgrattan at brasenose.oxford.ac.uk]
Subject: LL-L: "Romance connection" (was "Morphology") LOWLANDS-L,
04.MAY.2000 (04) [E] (fwd)

--- Matthew McGrattan <matthew.mcgrattan at brasenose.oxford.ac.uk> wrote:
> > In Edinburgh the old name for a wino was a "Jake a loo" and those
> guys drank
> > the most amazing concoctions. (Recipes only offline. :-). Could
> this have
> > originated from 'Jacques a l'haut' I wonder? If so it's either of
> pretty old
> > origins or possibly introduced by French sailors much later on, it
> has
> > certainly been current as far back as the early 1900's. Who knows?
> > I wonder of some of those words are found in Ulster?
>
 Jakey (plural Jakies) is still in common usage in Scotland for a
 wino. I've heard it both in Glagsow and further east.

 Thanks,

 Matt

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From: R. F. Hahn [sassisch at yahoo.com]
Subject: Romance connection

I wrote regarding possible French loans in Low Saxon (Low German):

> And, of course, there are mysterious words such as _Schisslaweng_ > 'flourish',
> 'grandiose manner', and _Fisematenten_ 'shenanigans', 'fuss', 'to-do'.  > The
> latter two have long been suspected of being of French origin and have > also
> been discussed on this list, but I do not think anyone has come up with a
> totally plausible explanation so far.

Alternative forms of _Fisematenten_ (and it occurs only in what appears to be
a plural form with _-en_) are _Fisamatenten_ and _Fießematenten_.  Added
meanings are '(lame) excuses', 'quibbling', 'prevarication'.

Interestingly, the _Herkunftsduden_ lists this as a German word, spelling it
_Fisimatenten_, mentioning that it occurs in numerous variations, and it makes
no reference to Low Saxon (Low German) in this context.  I knew that
_Fisematenten_ is also used in Missingsch (i.e., German dialects on Low Saxon
substrates), e.g., "Nu halt aba ma auf mit die Fisematenten!" (Low Saxon "Nu
hool man maal up mit de Fisematenten!", Standard German "Nun höre aber mal mit
den Faxen auf!", 'You just stop the nonsense now!').  I did not know that it
is considered a Standard German word.  The _Herkunftduden_ says that the word
can be traced back as far as the 16th century.

I am still wondering if words like _Schisslaweng_ and _Fisematenten_ are
pseudo-French or pseudo-Latin, namely words that have been made up to *sound*
like French or Latin to the ears of Low Saxon or German speakers.  I do not
consider it impossible that not all words of this type go back to alterations
of existing French or Latin words or phrases but poke fun at the faddish use
of French and Latin in earlier time.  Thus, they may fall into categories that
one might call "mock French" and "mock Latin."  (My coinage.)

An example of this type of pseudo-Latin or mock Latin is found in Low Saxon,
German and English, and also in other European languages, I am sure:
_Hokuspokus_ 'hocus-pocus'.  What is clear is that it is a case of
pseudo-Latin.  Or is it mock Latin?  Or both?  There are differences regarding
the source.

My edition of the _Oxford Dictionary_ says nothing about the origin, and the
_American Heritage Dictionary_ says that 'hocus-pocus' may be an alteration of
Latin _Hoc est corpus_ 'This is the body'.  The English noun 'hoax' may be a
derivation of 'hocus', 'a short form of 'hocus-pocus'.

According to the _Herkunftsduden_, _Hokuspokus_ started as a pseudo-Latin hoax
magic formula _Hax, pax, max, deus adimax_ used among itinerant students.  In
its altered form it appears in literary works in the 17th century, first in
England as _hocas pocas_, then with several early variants also in Germany:
_Hockespockes_, _Okespockes_, _Oxbox_, _Hokospokos_.

In Germany, _Hokuspokus_ also occurs in longer set phrases, namely in pseudo
magic formulas, for instance used by stage magicians (i.e., today's
illusionists).  Most common is _Hokuspokus fidibus!_ (at which point the
"magic" takes place).  I wonder if it is a case of extension or if
_Hokuspokus_ is a shortened version of it.  In German, a favorite "magic"
formula, obviously extended, is _Hokuspokus fidibus! Dreimal 'Schwarzer
Kater'!_ ("Hokuspokus fidibus! Thrice 'Black Tomcat'!").

Best regards,

Reinhard/Ron

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