LL-L: "Phonology" LOWLANDS-L, 19.NOV.2000 (02) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

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 L O W L A N D S - L * 19.NOV.2000 (02) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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From: Stefan Israel [stefansfeder at yahoo.com]
Subject: "Phonology" (was "Anglo-Frisian

Ethan Barrett [barrett at kitcarson.net] wrote:

> Very interesting!  I had thought that the Middle English 'ye'
> had been
> derived from the Old English 'ge' , as in 'ge sindon' = 'you
> are', in which the g was pronounced as a y.

The pronoun "ye" (plural of "thou" does indeed derive from Old
English <ge> (among various spellings), but that is independent
of the purely orthographic development of the article "the" to
<ye>: they came to be spelled the same in print, but pronounced
entirely differently:  [ji:] vs. [ð@] (and [ði:]).

Stefan Israel
stefansfeder at yahoo.com

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From: Stefan Israel [stefansfeder at yahoo.com]
Subject: "Phonology" (was "Anglo-Frisian")

Ron wrote, concerning lenited /d/:

> > It's not surprising that Danish  [ð] sounds like [l]: l is
> > essentially a [d] with air escaping around the sides of the
> > tongue (thus l is called a lateral).  If the tongue does not
> cut
> > off airflow on the sides when forming [ð], you indeed get a
> > lateral, l-like [ð].
>
> That is interesting.  My theory had been that this isn't a
> real [ð] but a
> "lax" continuant that shares all features with [ð] except that
> it does not
> have actual friction.

Strictly speaking, you're right that we shouldn't call this
lateral d [ð], since that symbol usually stands for the
fricative with friction at the teeth, whereas lateral d has the
airflow stopped at the teeth like a d, but does have friction,
at the sides of the mouth.

> Yes, it seems to be an areal feature.  If I am not mistaken,
> deletion of
> /d/ also occurs in Southern Jutish dialects.  I wonder if this
> has
> something to do with a general tendency toward vowel
> "softening."  Note
> that in some Low Saxon dialects, especially the westernmost
> ones, there is
> virtually no aspiration of voiceless stops.  In all or most
> other dialects
> (and also in the Low-Saxon-influenced Missingsch varieties of
> German),
> aspiration occurs only word-initially
>[...]In some dialects, intervocalic
> unaspirated voiceless stops then turn into voiced ones

I think we can attribute this slow loss of contrast (d vs. j or
nothing, t/d, p/b etc.) to the heavy accent Germanic languages
have, primarily on the first syllable, that and the stress-based
speed of talking: Italian, e.g., devotes roughly equal time to
each syllable: it takes 10 times as long to say 10 syllables as
to say one.  In Germanic languages, it typically takes an equal
time to say 10 stressed syllables- which means unstressed
syllables have to be pronounced quickly, which encourages less
careful pronunciation.

Question: what patterns of weakening do we see in Platt (and
other Lowlands languages) in words with the accent towards the
end of the word (loan words, mostly)?
In my English, only the first t in _meta'tarsal_ is lenited to a
tap, since the second t begins the stressed syllable.  Scots
speakers- you'd pronounce it me'a-tarsal, with a full [t] in
-tars, yes?
  Does anyone know of Lowland varieties that lenite consonants
in the middle of the word -even- when the consonant starts the
stressed syllable?

Stefan Israel
stefansfeder at yahoo.com

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From: R. F. Hahn [sassisch at yahoo.com]
Subject: Phonology

Stefan, you wrote:

> Strictly speaking, you're right that we shouldn't call this
> lateral d [ð], since that symbol usually stands for the
> fricative with friction at the teeth, whereas lateral d has the
> airflow stopped at the teeth like a d, but does have friction,
> at the sides of the mouth.

But the sound in question, the one used in Danish where intervocalic and final
_d_ is written, seems to me to be something like an interdental or dental
*glide* -- a very lax version of [ð] or of a dental version of [d] ([d_]) in
which the tongue does not actually touch the teeth.  Yes, I believe that
slight lateral friction is at play at the same time, which would account for
the perception as [l] by non-native speakers.

In fact, I think it is the same or a similar sound as in Southern Castilian
and most Latin American dialects of Spanish for intervocalic /d/; e.g., in
_lado_ 'side', _poder_ 'to be able', _cada_ 'each', 'every'.  In some dialects
it comes to be very weak or in fact deleted; thus [lao], [po'er], ['kaa].
(This is probably what happened in Portuguese; e.g., _mãe_ 'mother', _pai_
'father' (cf. Spanish _madre_ and _padre_).  What is different in Danish is
that it can also occur syllable-finally.

I am wondering if this sound in Sylt North Frisian is/was really [ð] or this
assumed glide that we find in Danish.

Is there an IPA symbol for this sound that I assume to be a glide?

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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