LL-L: "Language politics" LOWLANDS-L, 15.MAR.2001 (02) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

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L O W L A N D S - L * 15.MAR.2001 (02) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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A=Afrikaans, Ap=Appalachean, D=Dutch, E=English, F=Frisian, L=Limburgish
LS=Low Saxon (Low German), S=Scots, Sh=Shetlandic, Z=Zeelandic (Zeeuws)
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From: Marco Evenhuis [evenhuis at zeelandnet.nl]
Subject:  LL-L: "Language politics" LOWLANDS-L, 15.MAR.2001 (01) [E]

Criostoir wrote:

>    Cornish place-names are occasionally used on the
> "welcome" signs at town and city limits

>    Cornish is not taught in school except as an
> extra-cirricular activity after school hours

>    There is minimal Cornish language presence on Radio
>    Cornwall (some thirty minutes a week although this
>   fluctuates) and there is a regular Cornish sermon in
>    Truro Cathedral. There is a small but vibrant
> Cornish language press which enjoys presence in
> local libraries. Camborne Library has an extensive
> Cornish language back issue section and subscribes
> to all the main Cornish language journals.

>    Cornish is available in night classes at Cornwall's
>    only instutute of Higher Education, Cornwall
> College

etc.

Criostoir seems to be a bit disappointed about the status of
Kernewek/Cornish in Cornwall. But I think that most enthusiasts for living
languages that are closely related to more powerful languages (Low
Saxon/German, Scots/English, Zeelandic-Limburgish-Low Saxon/Dutch, etc.) are
quite jealous of the position of this small, reanimated Celtic language with
only some 200 fluent speakers and a few who have studied it (if I'm
correct).

R. F. Hahn wrote:

> So I take it Limburgish *has* been officially recognized in the
Netherlands.

Yes it has, but not (yet) in Belgium.

> It is relatively easy to maintain that Dutch, Low Saxon, Zeelandic and
Limburgish
> are one language and that Scots is a part of English, because of the close
> genealogical relationship between them. It gets a little harder
maintaining
> that "Low German" is a part of German (considering that
> German speakers do not understand it unless they are extensively exposed
to
> it), but it has been done, as we all know.

Apart from the fact that the (sometimes close) relationship between a
language of power and a smaller, regional language has, as we all know,
little to do with determining whether a variety should be treated as a
separate language or not, I think that when you look at how well a variety
can be understood, it is just as hard maintaining that Low Saxon, Zeelandic
and Limburgish are the same language as Dutch as it is to maintain that Low
German is a part of German. Most varieties of Low Saxon, Limburgish and
Zeelandic are, in my experience just as hard to understand for a monolingual
Dutch speaker than Low German is for a speaker of German.
In case of Zeelandic, even a strong accent is very difficult to understand
for people whose ears are tuned to standard Dutch. Someone from Utrecht who
moved to a village in Zeeland a few years ago asked me why everyone spoke
Dutch with such a strong English(!) accent! Now, about three years later, he
easily understands people speaking with a strong accent, but still has
difficulties understanding (especially older) people speaking Zeeuws...

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From: Criostoir O Ciardha [paada_please at yahoo.co.uk]
Subject: LL-L: "Language politics" LOWLANDS-L, 15.MAR.2001 (01) [E]

A chairde,

Ron wrote:
> >     (c) What, if any, is the official status of
> Scots at present?

Colin replied:

> Confused. In different ways the British, Scottish
> and both Irish
> governments have accepted the status of Scots as a
> language
> different from English. However, in Scotland the
> practical
> consequences of this aren't much different from the
> previous
> (unstated) policy of eradication.

I feel that the customs and convention of official
status of languages of the United Kingdom - and I
would like to know what other subscribers from the UK
believe - is something akin to abject denial. Contrary
to popular opinion, the United Kingdom has no official
language: that includes English. However,
*conventionally* (it must be remembered that United
Kingdom law is based strongly on convention rather
than constitution), English is the de facto official
language.

Ultimately, it seems to me that the unwritten and
unspoken policy of the UK government is one where
English is the sole language of the UK. Other
languages are simply ignored in the hope that their
aberrant existence will disappear. Hence no
semi-official recognition for Cornish, Scots, or any
of the non-indigenous languages (e.g., Panjabi, Urdu,
Greek, Gujurati, Mandarin, etc.), much less any
official recognition.

It is true that Welsh is somewhat anomalous insofar as
that it has a presence in Wales that is strongly
maintained if subordinate to English. In the north of
Ireland, Irish enjoys de jure recognition due to the
Good Friday Agreement but is sadly conventionally
believed not to exist (one frequently finds references
in the media - both written and televisual - to the
"extinction" of Irish in the Six Counties, despite the
fact that I and most of my friends use it every day!).
Most people simply acquiesce to this or consider
themselves powerless.

Conventional apathy, don't you know.

Críostóir.

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