LL-L "Phonology" 2002.06.05 (05) [E]

Wed Jun 5 20:28:19 UTC 2002

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 L O W L A N D S - L * 05.JUN.2002 (05) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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 A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian L=Limburgish
 LS=Low Saxon (Low German) S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic Z=Zeelandic (Zeeuws)
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From: <burgdal32 at mac.com>
Subject: LL-L "Phonology" 2002.06.05 (02) [E]

> From: "Marco Evenhuis" <evenhuis at zeelandnet.nl>
> Subject: LL-L "Phonology" 2002.06.04 (04) [E]
>
> Frank Verhoft wrote:
>
>> Old Dutch _e_ before _r_ got stretched to a very open
>> /e:/. In Middle Dutch two forms are attested:
>> _pa(e)rt_ and _pe(e)rt_.
>> Modern *Standard* Dutch _paard_ is due to influence of
>> the Holland and Zeeuws dialects in which the result of
>> the /e/+r > open /e:/ and /a:/ merged. (Cf. Van Loon).
>> I think most dialects spoken in Flanders still have
>> the long (and open) /e:/ sound.
>> paard: _peerd_ (or _pjeed_)
>> paarden: _peerde_
>> paardje: _perdje_ (short /e/)

In my Flanders region I would spell
peird (ei like in French è) peirdje (also: perdje- perdjie)

> I think it isn't correct that Frank mentioned Zeeuws in
> this respect. In all dialects of Zeeuws, 'horse' is _peerd_,
> _perd_ or _paerd_.
> Some other examples (all three the above spellings,
> _ae_, _ee_, _e_, are used, but I just stick to _ae_ for
> now):

For peird, we have also : hors (horsen) ros. My city is called
'Roeselare'
(lare= empty space in the woods where horses(roes=ros) could be hold)

> aerdappel (or _petaote_ in some dialects): potatoe
> laerze: boot
> aerde: soil
> waerd: worth
> kaeze: candle
> aerm: poor
> waerm: warm
> etc.

We say:
FL eirappels (patatten)
FL botten (boots) and never laarzen
FL eirde (weireld)
FL kei(r)se  kei(r)si
FL aorme aormi
FL warme warmi

So not quiet the same.
> Regards,
>
> Marco
>
> ----------
>
> From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Phonology
>
> Marco,
>
> It seems to me that what you write _ae_ in Zeelandic is an allophone of
> the short phoneme /a/ when it is followed by syllable-final /r/.  It is
> also a special allophone in most Low Saxon (Low German) dialect, where
> /ar/ tends to be phonetically realized as something close to long /aa/
> in Standard Dutch: [a:].  Or it could be a long /aa/ followed by /r/.
> Thus, Low Saxon _Arm_ 'arm' is pronounced like English Australian "arm":
> [?a:m].
>
> Thus Zeelandic:
> laerze /larz@/ ~ /laarz@/ boot
> aerde /ard@/ ~ /aard@/ soil
> waerd /ward/ ~ /waard/ worth
> aerm /arm/ ~ /aarm/ poor
> waerm /warm/ ~ /waarm/ warm
>
> The spelling <aer> then, in my opinion, is an attempt at phonetic
> representation, is, theoretically speaking, redundant as long as the
> reader knows that <ar> or <aar> has that particular pronunciation.
>
> "What about Zeelandic _kaeze_ 'candle' then," you might ask.  I assume
> that there is an /r/ underlying (/karz@/ ~ /kaarz@/) but not spelled.
> (Cf. German _Kerze_ 'candle')
>
> I tend to favor the theory that it is a short /a/ lenthened by /r/, as
> in Low Saxon:
>
> arm /arm/ [?a:m] 'poor' (= Austr. "arm")
FL aormi aorme
> harm /harm/ [ha:m] 'harm' (= Austr. "harm")
> warm /varm/ [va:m] 'warm'
FL  warme
> Hart /hart/ [ha:t] 'heart' (= Austr. "heart")
FL herte
> Karr /kar/ [ka:] 'cart', 'wagon', 'barrow' (= Austr. "car")
FL karre (celtic word)
> Karn /karn/ [ka:n] 'kernel', 'pip', 'nucleus'
FL kerni kerne
> Arf /arf/ [?a:f] 'pea'
FL erwete
> Kark /kark/ [ka:k] 'church' (= Austr. "to kark")
FL kerki kerke
> scharp /Sarp/ [Sa:p] 'sharp' (= Austr. "sharp")
FL skerp skerpe sherpe
> Wark /vark/ [va:k] 'work'
FL werk (arbeid)
> Farken /fark at n/ ['fa:kN=] 'piglet'
FL big (zwijnejong) biggetje fikk'n
>
> Versus *long* /aa/ followed by syllable-final /r/, which is pronounced
> quite differently:
>
> Aard ~ Aart ~ Oort ~ Ort /aard/ [?Q:at] ~ [?o:at] 'type', 'kind'
FL aord (naorie)
> Haar ~ Hoor /haar/ [kQ:a] ~ [ho:a] 'hair'
FL aor
> Baard ~ Baart ~ Boort /baard/ [bQ:at] ~ [bo:at] 'beard'
FL baord
> Aars ~ Oors ~ Ors /aars/ [?Q:as] ~ [?o:as] 'arse', 'ass'
FL ei(r)s
> Fahrt ~ Fohrt /faart/ [fQ:at] ~ [fo:at] 'trip', 'drive', 'ride'
FL vaort
> Aarn ~ Oorn ~ Orn /aarn/ [?Q:an] ~ [?o:an] 'harvest' (cf. 'earn')
...?   We have FL " herfst "(vallen van't blad)(E = autumn) biginning of
the
harvest ?
> Schaar(d) ~ Schoor(d) /Saar(d)/ [SQ:a(t)] ~ [So:a(t)] 'cliff', 'shard'
FL skaore skaori sjgaore
> Maard ~ Moord /maard/ [mQ:at] ~ [mo:at] 'marten'
>
> And it is pronounced quite differently from /aa/ not preceding /r/:
>
> faken ~ foken /faak at n/ ['fQ:kN=] ~ ['fo:kN=] 'often'
FL vaok
> Aas ~ Oos /aas/ [?Q:s] ~ [?o:s] 'carrion', 'evil person'
FL aoze aozi
> Hahn ~ Hohn ~ Haan /haan/ [hQ:n] ~ [ho:n] 'rooster'
FL aone aoni
> Maat /maat/ [mQ:t] ~ [mo:t] 'mate'
FL maot
>
> In several cases where Dutch writes <aar> and you write <aer> in
> Zeelandic, Low Saxon has /eir/ (though unfortunately spelled <eer> in
> Germany).  Note that /ei/ is realized as /E.I/ or as /a.I/, depending on
> the dialect, but in some dialects (e.g., those in the Lower Elbe area)
> /eir/ (i.e., /ei/ followed by syllable-final /r/) is pronounced as
> though it had a long /ii/: [i:3]; e.g.,
>
> Eerde ~ Eerd' ~ Eer ~ Ier /eird@/ ['?E.Irde] ~ [?E.I3t] ~ [?E:I3]
> ~ [?i:3] 'earth', 'soil'
> Peerd ~ Pierd /peird/ [pE.I3t] ~ [pi:3t] 'horse'
> Peerde ~ Peerd' ~ Peer ~ Pier /peird@/ [pE.I3de] ~ [pE:I3d] ~
> [pE:I3]~ [pi:3] 'horses'
> weerd ~ weert ~ wiert /weirt/ [vE.I3t] ~ [vi:3t] 'worth', 'worthy'
FL weirt
> Heern ~ Hiern /heirn/ [he.I3n] ~ [hi:3n] 'herring' (Dutch _haring_,
FL aorink
> dialectal/archaic German _Harung_)
>
> Regards,
> Reinhard/Ron

Regards
Luc Vanbrabant
Oekene (Roeselare)

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