LL-L "Language varieties" 2002.10.31 (08) [E]

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From: Jim Gretch <jgretch at ugf.edu>
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2002.10.31 (01) [E]

I generally agree with Robert Bowman when he writes regarding
the "rout/root" pronunciations of "route":

> I seem to flip between the two almost randomly. There are a
> few words like 'crick' for a small stream that I'll modify
> to the standard 'creek' if I'm being more formal, but the
> rout/root variations seem equally acceptable.

However, my perception is that the "rout" variety sounds
more informal (comfortable), while the "root" pronunciation
is usually more deliberate.

Likewise, being a fellow Montanan, I alternate between
"creek" and "crick" according to a native/non-native
register--I say "crick" to other Montanans but "creek" to
those I recognize as being from other areas.  Local toponyms
such as "Lick Creek" or "Belt Creek" stike me as forced if
pronounced with the "ee," however.

Regarding Ron's question, I also pronounce "roof" with the
same vowel as "put" unless I'm speaking with an "out-of-stater,"
in which case, I carefully choose the same vowel as in "proof."
"Hoof" never changes, however.

Whenever I hear "mayzhr" for "measure," I mentally locate
the speaker as having come from the South, probably even
the Ozarks or Appalachians....  That's just an impression,
though, and I'm sure our Appalachian experts can better comment
on that.

Lastly, you may enjoy the following true story about
regional accents.

Several years ago, two young Mormon (LDS) missionaries
from out-of-state were shopping in a local (Great Falls,
Montana) store.  When they came to check out, the clerk
asked them, "D'you wanna bag for those?"  The young men
replied, "No, we'd like to pay for them."

Jim Gretch
Great Falls, Montana

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From: Ed Alexander <edsells at cogeco.ca>
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2002.10.31 (01) [E]

At 07:28 AM 11/01/02 -0800, George wrote:
>Another good
>test is "nice" where we also have the strong schwa followed by IPA ij
>["A"ij]. In my phonetic spelling of some of my poems, I spell this
>Canadianism 'nuys" whereas I would spell what I hear most Americans saying
>as "nahiss" or in some states "naahs".

Good one, George, yo-u're a nuys guy, eh?

>   I seem to flip between the two almost randomly. There are a few words
like
>'crick' for a small stream that I'll modify to the standard 'creek' if I'm
>being more formal, but the rout/root variations seem equally acceptable.
>I've
>never noticed a strong regional pattern either.

I find that the most in-bred Canadjuns around here invariably use the
latter.

>What about "measure"?  Do you pronounce it as "mayzhr" or as "mezzhr"?  And
>what about "roof"?  With a long "oo" or with a short one as in "put"?  (The
>same goes for "hoof".)

Lord help me if I ever use the short "oo" in hoof and roof, as that's a
pretty dead giveaway to people around here that you're a Yank.  Once again,
the Canadjun pronunciation is closer to the actual spelling.

>Indeed, he's got it!  Yeah, that's it I think (finally stopping to mumble
>the sound).  Yes, the second component seems to be tense [u] rather than
lax
>[U].

Yes, and it both rises and falls, although I'm not sure if there's a
contextual reason for this.   E.g.,  in "we're going down south for the
winter", the ou in south is usually falling.

Ed Alexander

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