LL-L "Orthography" 2002.10.31 (02) [S]

[Lowlands-L]

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From: John M. Tait <jmtait at wirhoose.co.uk>
Subject: LL-L "Orthography" 2002.10.27 (04) [S]

Sandy wrate:
>
>Nouadays I aye uizes automatic transliteration tools tae
>prepare the texts on ScotsteXt for uploadin.
>
>This means that whan A come across spellins A dinna richt
>unnerstaun, A canna git past them wi a wee bit internal
>bletherie ony mair!
>
>As weel, the orthographic considerations for electronic
>texts can be a bit different in their ettle nor texts for
>fowk haein read at. In parteeclar:
>
>    o    bein technically (or historically) richt is like
>         tae be mair important than the text leukin familiar
>         (wi hou the wirds can be translatit intae mair
>         familiar spellins automatic);
>
>    o    it's better if a spellin can staun as a unique
>         signifier for a wird (sae's the transliteration
>         saftware disna git fanklt ower the likes o <wid>
>         ("wood") an <wud> ("mad"), for example, it wad be
>         better tae wale <wid> for "wood" - if the <wud>
>         spellin wis nott at the last, the transliterator
>         could haunle it).

>Onywey, ae parteeclar area o spellin A'm no shuir aboot is
>auxiliaries, espaecially the conditionals written in English
><would>, <could> an <should>, an as weel, <shall>.
>
>The questions is:
>
>    o    A tak it that the best wey tae spell <could> an
>         <should> is wi the saicondary vowel, ie <cuid> an
>         <shuid>?

I gree wi Andy here - the regional variants disna shaw the UI diaphoneme.

I wad gang wi 'coud' an 'shoud' - again the <u> whaur the war <l> - the fact
at the <u> is thare in English tae disna maiter.
>
>    o    Ar the ony kin o differ wirth preservin atween the
>         forms <shuid> an <shall> an <suid> an <sall> in
>         traditional texts, or wad A be as weel tae settle
>         on the tae kin o sibilant an lat the transliterator
>         owerset tae the tither gin it's wantit?

Again I gree wi Andy, at the'r nae differ apairt frae the pronunciation. The
pronuncins 'sood' an 'sall' is fameeliar ti me frae Shetlandic, likely the
aulder wey. I wad haud wi the writer's practics.
>
>    o    What alternative spellins ar the for <wad>, that
>         wad sinder it fae <wad> meanin "mairy"? The SND
>         suggests <wald> - appearinly the /l/ is or wis
>         soondit in some airts, but A div still want the
>         electronic texts tae be in weel-kent Scots for whan
>         a transliterator's no tae haun. A dout <wald> micht
>         no be a guid representation o the uizual range o
>         pronunciations ootthrou the Lawlands?

Thare is a conflict here atween sinderin ilka wird frae ither (like ye hae
ti dae for yer foond-text) an sinderin homographs in onie actual text for
readin - whaur, alang wi Andy, I wad threip at this is no necessar.

Coorse I suppose the logical spellin o auld _wald_ wad be _waud_, follaein
the common orthographic practice o writin 'u' for vocalised 'l' - sae _haud_
frae _hald_, _saut_ frae _salt_, etc. Thare's nae muckle precedent for this
in writin this word, I dinna think, but ye coud uise it (or <wald> for that
maiter) as yer oreeginal spellin, juist for the sake o the transliterator,
coud ye? I dinna think ye can get onie ither kenspeckle spellin wi'oot a
homograph wi aither 'wad', 'wid' or 'wud'. (I pronunce it [wId], but I write
it <wad>). At onie rate, I 'waudna' follae whit a lot o Scots writers dis,
an spell 'wid' (Eng. wood) as <wuid>, cause that raivels the diaphonemics.

John M. Tait.

http://www.wirhoose.co.uk

----------

From: John M. Tait <jmtait at wirhoose.co.uk>
Subject: LL-L "Orthography" 2002.10.27 (10) [S]

Sandy wrate:

>A startit the mail in English an syne efter typin twathree
>wirds decidit tae write it in Scots insteed - A maun a forgotten
>tae chainge the English "I" intae a Scots "A" in the first sentence!

Nou hing on a meenutie! Ye canna say at 'I' is English an 'A' is Scots -
baith pronunciations exists in sindrie dialects (whiles wi a
emphatic/unemphatic sinderin) an the chyce o <I> or <A> is mair or less a
bawbee-flingin maiter. Coorse, I ken ye'r spaekin aboot yer ain practics
here - hou ye sinder the English an Scots in spellin.

>Hivin sayed aa this, baith ma spellins an Colin's is aa fanklt
>wi English orthographic 'principles', an sae ye can haurly expeck
>conseestency onywey! A ken fine nouadays hou tae heyst masel oot
>this historic boggie, but A'v got it on guid authority that naebody
>wad want tae read ma Scots if A did!

This is no necessarily true. Ye coud mak up a consistent spellin for Scots
foondit on English orthography - for example, consonant-dooblin rules - as
lang as ye war willin ti re-spell aa the English words at disna conform ti
thae rules - like _door_ -> <doar>, _tongue_ -> <tung>, etc. Forby, pairt o
the raivelment o English spellin comes frae the fact at the'r mair nor ae
kynd o spellin in uiss - ane for words o Auld English origin (did we decide
at 'springheid' wisna a richt word?), an anither - wi different consonant
dooblin rules, for example - for Latinate an Greek words (no ti mention the
French an ither anes, like 'touch'). Sae ye'v ti recognise thaim as sindrie
systems - an morphological spellins the likes o '-na' an '-fu' as anither. I
whiles wonder whit Scots spellin wad be like gin it wis spelt efter the
spellin rules o the Latin an Greek loanwords - wi nae, or little, consonant
dooblin, for example. I ken ye'v cleckit sic a system yersel afore nou, but
wad it be different gin the ettle wis ti haud the Latinate an Greek word i
the same system? Wad it be possible?

Haith - I'v likely stertit ye aff again....!

Here's a phoneme leet, wi my ain spellin practics (foondit on the Spellin
Comatee anes). This is a maistly non-technical ASCII version, uisin capitals
for spellins insteid o bold or <chevrons> (if that's whit ye caa thaim) an
maistly invertit commas for roch pronunciations. Cause this wis written for
Scots, the pronunciation guide is foondit on SSE - Scottish Standard
English. I hinna pitten in onie phonetics as sic, except for ti shaw the
differin pronunciations o the /ai/ diphthong. The phoneme script is foondit
on SAMPA, an is no ettelt ti be phonetically accurate. In the /e-/ an /e+/
phonemes, the /-/ an /+/ is ti shaw at, in sindrie dialects, /e+/ tends ti
rise ti [i] (eg: _breid_ can be [bred] or [brid]) an /e-/ ti faa ti [E]
(_bairn_ can be [be:rn] or [bE:rn]) Merk at the examples gien includes
English cognate words, whan thay'r spelt efter the same rules I uise for
Scots as a hale.

John M. Tait.

Pronunciation and Spelling of Scots Vowel Phonemes.

/ / - Underlying phonemes (of Scots seen as a whole)
[ ] - Broad phonetic approximations

/a/ - Pronounced as in SSE cat.

Spelt A, as in slap, grat, tag

/A/ - as in SSE caught, or in some dialects as a longer form of the A in SSE
cat.

Spellings:

AU usually initial and medial - aumrie, auld, fauld, faur, waur
AW final - craw, braw - and initial and medial in some words, e.g. awfu,
bawd, bawbee, bawsant
AA where English and older Scots have final -ALL, e.g. baa, faa, aa, aabodie
A final in na, wha, twa, awa and ava.

/E/ - as in SSE let

Spelt E, e.g. hert, gless, teckle (Note: there is considerable dialect
variation between /e-/ and /E/).

/e-/ - as in SSE hair

Spellings:

AI initial and medial e.g. airt, airm, sair, mair
AE final, e.g. brae, strae

/e+/ - Pronounced in some dialects as 'ee' in SSE seen, in others as 'ai' in
SSE hair.

Spellings:

EI e.g. heid, breid, deid (usually where EA in the English cognate is
pronounced 'e')
AE or EA, e.g. maet, aets, baet (usually where EA in the English cognate is
pronounced 'ee')

/e/ - as SSE gate, with some dialect variation (such as NE 'steen', stane,
and 'wyle', wale).

Spelt A-E, e.g. hame, stane, wale.

/I/ - Pronounced as in SSE sin; but in some dialects often as 'u' in SSE
sun.

Spelt I - e.g. sin, wind, hill

/i/ - Pronounced as in SSE seen .

Spellings:

EE - e.g. neep, greet, reek, eediom, speerit
IE typically before CH, R, V, L(D) and ST - e.g. driech, spier, scrieve,
bield, chiel, niest.

/O/ - Pronounced in some dialects as in SSE got, in others as 'oa' in SSE
goat

Spelt O - e.g. on, got, shop, lot, loch

/o/ - Pronounced as in SSE goat

Spellings:

OA - e.g. coat, throat, gloaming
O-E - e.g. thole, hole

/V/ - Pronounced as in SSE cut

Spelt U - e.g cut, but, gun.

/u/ - Pronounced as in SSE moon (in some dialects approaching the sound of
German ü)

Spellings:

OU - e.g. doun, fouth, fou, hou
OO where the English cognate has OU pronounced 'ow', e.g. hoose, moose, oot,
oor.

/y/ - Pronounciations as follows:

1. Like German Ö or Ü in some conservative dialects - e.g. 'spün', 'pör',
'öz'.
2. 'ee' in the North East - e.g. 'speen', 'fleer', 'eeze'
3. 'ai' (long) and 'i' (short) in most Central dialects - e.g. 'spin',
'pair', 'yaize'.

Spelling: UI, e.g. spuin, fluir, uise

(Note that UI words usually have an 'oo' sound in the English cognate - e.g.
spoon, poor, use).

/ju/ (original /y/ + velar) - Pronounced as EW in SSE few, but in some
dialects as U in SSE luck.

Spelt EU - e.g. heuk, neuk, teuk, leuk, leuch, eneuch

(Because of the different pronunciation distribution, the EU spelling is
preferable to UI before K and CH.)

/ai/- as in SSE bite, five ( [b at It], [faiv] - determined by Scots Vowel
Length Rule).

Spellings:

I-E or Y-E according to precedent in most identical English cognates, e.g.
bike, sine (trigonometric), ripe, bite, line, hide, (mega)byte, hype, five,
rise, tired, tyre, byre.

Y-E (Y before consonant clusters) in most words without obvious or identical
cognates in modern standard English, and for words corresponding to English
OI, e.g. byke, syne, rype, gype, synd, hyne, kythe, kye, jyne, byle

Y before consonant clusters even in identical English cognates, e.g. mynd,
kynd. (?)

EY finally for the short sound only - e.g. gey, fey, stey

/ou/ - as in SSE how

Spelt OW medial, OWE final - nowt, growe

http://www.wirhoose.co.uk

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