LL-L "Names" 2003.02.22 (03) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

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From: PPMAC56 at aol.com <PPMAC56 at aol.com>
Subject: LL-L "Names" 2003.02.20 (07) [E]

As a "lurker" of several weeks standing, I have decided to break cover on
the subject of place-name pronunciation.
1. I've never seen the name "Frankford", only Frankfurt. I have seen both
Hanover and Hannover.
2. I think R.F. Hahn is right about Brunswick and Hanover being familiar
names to Britons because of the royals; although my own first recollection
of the word "Brunswick", if my memory is correct, was from a record label.
3. I have always thought that it is more courteous, and facilitates
understanding, if, when using place-names, you use the spelling used by the
natives of that place, if you know it. I suppose the level of knowledge one
has of such things depends on how much you travel or communicate with people
from other countries. The media can help in this respect too. How many
people nowadays still refer to Peking, Bombay, Burma or Siam, to name biut a
few. I know many people do not know the native names for places, so perhaps
one of the added benefits of a forum like this is education.

I've enjoyed reading all the posting. Hope to write again soon.

Peter McLean

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From: R. F. Hahn <admin at lowlands-l.net>
Subject: Names

Peter,

Welcome among the "unlurked" and to the List!  It's good to see you come
forward, and I hope to "hear" from you again soon.

Friendly regards,
Reinhard/Ron

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From: Holger Weigelt <platt at holger-weigelt.de>
Subject: Names

> R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>:
> Subject: Names
>
> Criostóir, a chara,
>
> Scríobh tú (réamhráite):
>
> > This caught me totally by surprise. I have a German friend whose surname
> is "Brunswicker"
> > [sic, no diacritics] - how did this Anglicised form come about? Surely
it
> should be
> > *Braunschweiger?......
>.....Many supposedly "German"
> names are in fact Lowlands Saxon (Low German), including a lot owned by
> people on this list, asnd Brunswick is within the old Saxon-speaking
region,
> though just barely, sitting on the southern edge.
>
> I have always assumed that English "Brunswick" comes from a medieval Saxon
> version of the name.  I am not quite sure what the versions were at the
> time, but I think it was _Brunswik_, apparently from Old Saxon
_Bruneswic_,
> probably "Brun(o)'s Bay" (after the Liudolfinger earl, father of the
> "Brunonis"/"Brunonen" dynasty).
>
> Mar sin leibh an dr sda!
>
> Reinhard/Ron
>
Hello Ron !
I doubt Your translation of _Brunswik_ as "Bruno's Bay" because I believe
_wik_ to be the same old word for a village-centre with a church as we have
it in East-Frisian (for example in the "Brookmerbrief", an ancient
collection of laws).
In nowadays Eastern Friesland Low Saxon however a "wîk" is a canal resp. the
way and the settlement besides a canal. You often find this word in street
names of the "Fehn"-villages (in the Germanized version _Wieke_).
I don't know the etymology but I could imagine that old Frisian _wic_ and
Low Saxon _wîk_  only sound similar by incident but don't have the same
root.
Kind greetings
Holger

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