LL-L "Phonology" 2003.06.05 (06) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

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L O W L A N D S - L * 05.JUN.2003 (06) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West)Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
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From: "Stella en Henno" <stellahenno at hetnet.nl>
Subject: LL-L "Phonology" 2003.06.04 (05) [E]

> From: "Jim Rader" <jrader at Merriam-Webster.com>
> Subject:  LL-L "Phonology" 2003.06.04 (03) [E]
>
> [knip].
>
> As I think someone (our moderator?) noted, there is lots of allophonic
> variation among speakers of Lowlands and Scandinavian languages
> who have some kind of uvular /r/, as you native speakers across  the
> Pond doubtless know.  I notice that many (most?) Dutch speakers from
> the Randstand area, whether they use a uvular or alveolar /r/ initially
> and medially, have a peculiar sound word-finally that is quite close to
> American English /r/.  Collins & Mees call it a "prevelar bunched
> approximant."
>
> Has uvular /r/ penetrated West Frisian or Low German dialects?  Or do
> they maintain an alveolar trill or tap?  What about Dutch dialects in
> Belgium?

To react to the West Frisian: no, almost everyone uses the "tongue r"
although
some people have more guttural r's; this is called "brijkje".
Interesting
enough, in the towns where Town Frisian (a Dutch dialect on Frisian
substratum) has supplanted WF, there is a strong tendency to speak with
a
very guttural r. It's almost as "bad" as the French one, especially in
Leeuwarden and Harlingen.

Henno Brandsma

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From: Críostóir Ó Ciardha <paada_please at yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: LL-L "Phonology" 2003.06.05 (01) [E]

Ruud wrote:
"Which r's do you mean? Initial/medial ones, or final ones? Final r's
in most kinds of British English (except West-England and Scotland
of course) are not just weak, but simply absent, or only still
betrayed by the length of the preceding vowel. I think it has that
in common with South-African, Australian, and Boston/New York (New
England?) type American English. But perhaps I misunderstood your
remark."

In some Nottingham English forms and many other Midlands variants, /r/
in all places (initial, medial, final) is absent,
although initially there is usually a rhoticity (i.e., an r-like glide,
just as French has an n-like glide known as nasalisation).

My remark was a dithering question, best reformed thus: have Midland,
Southern and Northern Englishes (South-West
is excluded) always lacked a definite r-sound or has this been a
development of Modern English? If so, why, how and
when exactly were r-sounds in English largely dropped?
Go raibh maith agat

Criostóir.

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