LL-L "Names" 2003.11.09 (07) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

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L O W L A N D S - L * 09.NOV.2003 (07) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West)Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
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From: Holger Weigelt <platt at holger-weigelt.de>
Subject: "Names"

> From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Names
>
> I think it would be nice if we compiled, as a concerted effort, a small
> comparative list of traditional Lowlandic "first" (given) names.
Comparing
> names from language variety to language variety is (1) fairly interesting
> regarding sound shifts and abbreviation tendencies, and (2) "our public"
> likes things of this sort.  Who knows?  Perhaps it will cause some parents
> to give their new offspring Scots, Zeelandic, Limburgish, Lowlands Saxon
> (Low German), Appalachian and other variants of names.  If we did this, we
> ought to include "marginal" or contact varieties (e.g., German, Jutish,
> Danish, Walloon, French, Cornish, Welsh, Manx, Gaelic and Irish) for
> comparison as well as to give clues about contacts and borrowing.
>
> Giving children dialect variants (as opposed to power language varieties)
as
> legal names is a growing trend, in my opinion a nice one that ought to be
> encouraged.  An example is "Kathrin" in Northern Germany, as opposed to
> German "Katharina," "Catharina" etc.  In the olden days that was not even
> allowed.  Someone who was called "Kathrin" by everyone had to have a
German
> variant as her legal name, and someone who was called "Hannes" had to have
> the German variant "Johannes" as his legal name.  (Germany does not permit
> total freedom of choice in naming a child, requires parents to choose from
a
> list of officially permissible names or otherwise furnish official proof
> that a name is commonly accepted in another country -- though all this is
> now much easier than it was in the past.)
>
> In a list of that sort, we'd have to make an effort to identify as many
> spelling variants as possible.  For instance, today I finally realized
that
> the name of an Australian friend of mine is really the same of that of Wir
> Sandy (Fleming, "Alexander" > Scots "Sandy," pronounced "Sawny," if I
> remember correctly): Sonny, and I know another Australian named Sawny.
> Sawny may be of (part) Scottish descent, while Sonny is Hong-Kong-born,
> Australian-raised and "dinky-die" Cantonese with an "Australian mouth."
>
> What do folks think about this list idea?
>
> Tata!
> Reinhard/Ron
>
Hello Ron !
Nice idea ! I 'd like to add EFLS variants but which version ?  A problem
with many Eastern Friesland Low Saxon names (especially o-ending male names)
is that they exist in an "official" and a "spoken" version. The "official"
version normally is the written one which is registered. For a linguistical
comparison I think the "spoken" version is needed, too. If, however,
non-LS-speakers give their children EFLS names they pronounce them according
to the written version.
Some examples official vs. spoken:
Onno / Oen
Tammo / Tâm
Krino / Krîn
Ubbo / Ueb
Other differences between writing and pronounciation are mostly due to the
German based orthography (examples: Jan / Jân; Antje / Āntje [a:Ic@]; Gretje
/ Gräitje; Gertje / Gitje, Berendina / Bendīna etc.).
Kind regards
Holger

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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Names

Thanks, Holger.  Good to know you're interested in being on board.

> I 'd like to add EFLS variants but which version ?

By all means!  As usual, I would not advocate a "one version per language"
approach.  The more the merrier.  In the case of EFLS this is absolutely
required due to considerable differences and the East Frisian substrate that
is particularly noticeable in names, as your example above show.

You could have the spoken version parenthesized, following each "official"
version.

By the way, those spoken versions seem to be along the lines of English
"Peter" = "Pete," "James" = "Jim," "Margaret" = "Mag," "Kimberly" = "Kim,"
etc., and Lowlands Saxon (Low German) "Johannes" > "Jehannes" = "Jan" and
"Kathrin" = "Trien" (~ "Trine").

Cheers!
Reinhard/Ron

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