LL-L "Etymology" 2003.10.08 (11) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

======================================================================
L O W L A N D S - L * 08.OCT.2003 (11) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
http://www.lowlands-l.net * lowlands-l at lowlands-l.net
Rules & Guidelines: http://www.lowlands-l.net/index.php?page=rules
Posting Address: lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org
Server Manual: http://www.lsoft.com/manuals/1.8c/userindex.html
Archives: http://listserv.linguistlist.org/archives/lowlands-l.html
Encoding: Unicode (UTF-8) [Please switch your view mode to it.]
=======================================================================
You have received this because you have been subscribed upon request.
To unsubscribe, please send the command "signoff lowlands-l" as message
text from the same account to listserv at listserv.linguistlist.org or
sign off at http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html.
=======================================================================
A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West)Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
=======================================================================

From: Antero Helasvuo <antero.helasvuo at welho.com>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2003.10.08 (09) [E]

>>Apparently, Finnish _kansa_ 'folk', 'people' was derived from an Old
>>Germanic version of the word (> _kansakunta_ 'nation', _kansallisuus_
>>'nationatity', _kansalaulu_ 'folksong', _kansatanssi_ 'folkdance', etc.).
>
>I have been wondering about the _k-_ here.   Germanic
>*_hana_ > Finnish _hana_ 'tap', 'faucet', 'spigot' (cf. German _Hahn_, LS
>_haan_, Danish _hane_ 'tap', 'faucet', 'spigot').
>
>Unfortunately, I can't find a comparative Finnic, Finno-Ugric or Uralic
>index online that could shed light on this.
>
>Any ideas?

A very very hasty answer: Firstly it's _kansanlaulu_ (folk's song) not
kansalaulu etc. but yes _kansakunta._ Secondly, the _hana > kana_
transformation might be due to the Russian influence, compare
Hitler>Gitler and _galanda_ = Dutch. Later.

--
Antero Helasvuo
Luutnantinpolku 9 C 20
00410 HELSINKI
FINLAND

TEL (fax on demand) +358 9 5872345
antero.helasvuo at welho.com

----------

From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Etymology

Hei, Antero!

You wrote above:

> Firstly it's _kansanlaulu_ (folk's song) not
> kansalaulu etc. but yes _kansakunta._

Thanks.  So it's a genitive construction for the first and not for the
second.

> Secondly, the _hana > kana_
> transformation might be due to the Russian influence, compare
> Hitler>Gitler and _galanda_ = Dutch. Later.

I'm not sure if I will buy this one.  It's supposed to be a very old loan.
Also, Russian would have had to borrow the word first (> *_ган(а)_
[*gan(a)]) and then pass it on to Finnish (> _kana_).  I don't think there
is any evidence of that.

Se on pulmallinen asia ...  ;)

Sydämelliset terveiset!
Reinhard/Ron

================================END===================================
* Please submit postings to lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org.
* Postings will be displayed unedited in digest form.
* Please display only the relevant parts of quotes in your replies.
* Commands for automated functions (including "signoff lowlands-l") are
  to be sent to listserv at listserv.linguistlist.org or at
  http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html.
=======================================================================