LL-L "Etymology" 2004.08.21 (05) [A/E]

[Lowlands-L]

======================================================================
L O W L A N D S - L * 21.AUG.2004 (05) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
http://www.lowlands-l.net * lowlands-l at lowlands-l.net
Rules & Guidelines: http://www.lowlands-l.net/index.php?page=rules
Posting: lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org or lowlands-l at lowlands-l.net
Server Manual: http://www.lsoft.com/manuals/1.8c/userindex.html
Archives: http://listserv.linguistlist.org/archives/lowlands-l.html
Encoding: Unicode (UTF-8) [Please switch your view mode to it.]
=======================================================================
You have received this because you have been subscribed upon request.
To unsubscribe, please send the command "signoff lowlands-l" as message
text from the same account to listserv at listserv.linguistlist.org or
sign off at http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html.
=======================================================================
A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West)Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
=======================================================================

From: Ruth & Mark Dreyer <mrdreyer at lantic.net>>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2004.08.20 (05) [E]

Beste Liza en Reuben,

Onderwerp, Etymologie

> > tydig = ? Not sure about the exact meaning of this one, it's not a word
I
> > use often. Help?

'kom tog voor!
Tydig - op tyd, betyds, vroegtydig. (Verklarende Afrikaanse Woordeboek -
Kritzinger Labuschagne en Pienaar)

> The words quoted by Liza are so similar to those in my Plautdietsch
> mother tongue that  I read them easily (I think), including _tydig_,
> which she asks about.

Mind you, Reuben, it sounds easier to the Afrikaner's ear than it spells to
the eye. Reinhard has made this point already. If we had a common
orthography, there'd be even less difference between our dialects;
certainly, better understanding!.

> _Wi woare tiedig oppstohne_ (We shall get up early).
        _Ons sal tydig opstaan_
Tog moet ek byvoeg, u snap seker al klaar, dat 'wi' of 'wij' van ons Taal
weggeval het. En is 'woare' nie nader aan ons 'wil' as ons 'sal' of die
Engelse 'shall' nie? Nog 'n ding, in die verband sal 'n Afrikaner ieder die
woord 'vroeg' as 'tydig' gebruik.

groete,
Mark

----------

From: Ruth & Mark Dreyer <mrdreyer at lantic.net>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2004.08.20 (07) [E]

Dear Patrick or Cynthia Karl & Ron

Subject: Semantics

> >
> >>te(gen) = English tug, perhaps? Much gentler than "pull".
> >
> >It's the cognate of German _ziehen_, Yiddish ציען _cien_, Gothic
_tiuhan_,
> >and Old English _tēon_.  I don't think there is a Modern English cognate,
> >but I'm not at all sure.

There's 'tug', I'm sure, & also 'tow'. There was a vowel-shift, wasn't there
somewhere between Northern & Southern English dialects, under the influence
of which 'g' also changed value. High & front vowels evolved to 'y', back &
low vowels evolved to 'w' This phenomenon, if Afrikaans is any indication,
didn't happen on the Continent. Our cognate, 'tog', is pronounced as an
unvoiced alveolar fricative, 'x'. Another cute word is 'gate' - English,
'yet' - Inglis (for one of wraught iron), & 'gat' - Afrikaans (hole).

> I think there is an isolated cognate:  wanton.  Both parts of this word
> are interesting

Yyesss: 'wan (without)' + 'teon (pull)'! Actually it makes sense, in a
desparate kind of way.

> Patrick mentions English "wanton" above.  Good one!  It's derived from
> Middle English _wantowen_, i.e., from _towen_, the past participal form of
_
> "to tee" (Old English _téon_), and the negative prefix _wan-_ (like _un-_,
> cf. Lowlands Saxon _wanschapen_ "un-shaped" = 'ugly', 'unsightly').  So
> _wanton_ is the literal equivalent of German _ungezogen_ 'naughty', 'badly
> behaved' < "badly raised."

Apologies, Ron; you spotted that before me, & better.

> 'nickname'

Yes, well this was an original etymological deduction of my early youth. I
knew of 'eke' from a book of Robin Hood, I knew of the Scandinavian 'og', &
in Afrikaans we had 'ook'. So, I write & read, " 'n ook naam."
By the way, the Afrikaans is 'bynaam', which would I think, make sense to
some English too.

Yrs sincerely,
Mark

----------

From: Frank Verhoft <frank.verhoft at skynet.be>
Subject: Etymology

Hi Henry, all,

Henry:
<<<Does that have any relation to Twente Saxon "eek" (oak tree), "ekel" (oak
nut), and perhaps to Dutch "hekelen"? Come to think of it, if someone would
say he or she knew of the Dutch word "hekelnaam", that wouldn't surprise me
at all.<<<

As far as i could find there is no connection between Saxon 'ekel' (oak nut)
and Dutch 'hekelen'.
The verb 'hekelen' is related to Dutch 'haak' (hook) < Germ. *hakan, hoka,
hekan, while 'eke', 'ekel' goes back *aik-, *aiko (related to Middle English
'hekele' and 'hechele' (modern English 'hackle', 'hatchel').

Regards,

Frank
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/foreignlanguages/

================================END===================================
* Please submit postings to lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org.
* Postings will be displayed unedited in digest form.
* Please display only the relevant parts of quotes in your replies.
* Commands for automated functions (including "signoff lowlands-l") are
  to be sent to listserv at listserv.linguistlist.org or at
  http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html.
======================================================================