LL-L "Language varieties" 2004.09.01 (03) [E]

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A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West)Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
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From: burgdal32admin <burgdal32 at pandora.be>
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2004.08.31 (10) [E]

> From: Ruth & Mark Dreyer <mrdreyer at lantic.net>
> Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2004.08.30 (06) [E]
>
> Dear Denis, Luc, Dan, Burgdal, John,
>
> Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2004.08.29 (06) [E]
>
>> Apart from that, what tickles me, & has for a long time, that the
> 'Anglian'
>> features of Old English & Modern English are closer to Afrikaans than
>> the
>> Anglo-Saxon English of King Alfred's Court.
>>
>> Why would one refer in this context to Afrikaans, which in fact is a
>> very
>> new language, whereas Afrikaans itself was influenced and has loads of
>> sound-similarities with "westnederfrankisch" dialect Westflemish?
>
> Only because the features in question are familiar to me from my own
> tongue.
> Now, someone offered the thesis that Anglian developed its unique
> features
> in Britain. If this is so, then the very Wesnederfrankiese eienskappe -
> sorry - features common to Anglian _&_ to the Continental ancenstors of
> Afrikaans need examination: Not so? It seems to me rather, that
> Anglian was
> notably conservative of its Continental heritage.
>
>> The Anglo-saxon coast started in the region of Boulogne all the way up
>> to the  (now) Danish border.
> To---
>> Look at the placenames and compare them  with those on the other side
>> of the Channel.
>> A lot of historie has been "fastened" to quick.
>
> Ek stem saam. All too much 'History' gives all too little attention to
> migration. We read in our school history books about the 'Migratory
> Period'
> German, as though they were static before & static afterwards [I shake
> my
> head]. But look, you have an ally in Snorri Sturlusson. He wrote about
> the
> telling differences between place-names & the language of the 'current'
> occupiers.
>
>>>> The Old English dialects called Anglian most likely developed their
>>> distinguishing features in Britain.
>
>> Why should a London professor study Old  Flemish in order to
>> understand Old English  better?
>
> Why not? Parallel development & a common ancestry, to say nothing of
> similar
> influences, will all play their part in both tongues. Certainly we
> don't yet
> know everything about Old English. Insights developed from Old Flemish
> may
> well cast light on Old English. This is how code-breakers work in the
> Army.
> Natural languages can be 'broken' in the same way. That was how Ancient
> Egyptian & Sumerian were 'broken'.
>
> Die Uwe,
> Mark.

Hi Mark,
That's the importance of discussions like that.
Some more examples:
-Tacitus distinguishes different tribes and mixes already Celtic and
Germanic speakers. So German tribes were there  before the so-called
'Migratory  Period'.
-When the monks from Ireland came to christianise the people in
Flanders, in the seventh century, they must have been well understood
by the locals. I assume that the languages were very close.
-With this oldest Flemish sentence i quoted before (and i found two
different spellings of it) my point was that some scholars believe that
the languages in Kent and Flanders in that particular time,  were
almost identical. There was a lot of trading in this part of Western
Europe, and the separation of the two regions is only a few miles.

groetjes
luc vanbrabant
oekene

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