LL-L "Phonology" 2005.12.21 (05) [E]

[Lowlands-L]

======================================================================
L O W L A N D S - L * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
http://www.lowlands-l.net * lowlands-l at lowlands-l.net
Rules & Guidelines: http://www.lowlands-l.net/index.php?page=rules
Posting: lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org or lowlands-l at lowlands-l.net
Commands ("signoff lowlands-l" etc.): listserv at listserv.net
Server Manual: http://www.lsoft.com/manuals/1.8c/userindex.html
Archives: http://listserv.linguistlist.org/archives/lowlands-l.html
Encoding: Unicode (UTF-8) [Please switch your view mode to it.]
=======================================================================
You have received this because you have been subscribed upon request.
To unsubscribe, please send the command "signoff lowlands-l" as message
text from the same account to listserv at listserv.linguistlist.org or
sign off at http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html.
=======================================================================
A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West) Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeeuws)
=======================================================================

21 December 2005 * Volume 05
=======================================================================

From: Gary Taylor <gary_taylor_98 at yahoo.com>
Subject: LL-L Phonology

Hi all

Being true to my Hawaiian name of being the 'glottal
stop from the Estuary' and having been served for the
umpteenth time in Berlin two croissants instead of the
one I'd asked for, it got me thinking again about the
differences between (British) English and German use
of glottal stops.

When a word begins with a vowel in German it is
automatically preceded by a glottal stop, whether it
is stressed or unstressed or whether it comes in the
middle of a sentence or not.

In English this use of the glottal stop is slightly
different. At the beginning of a sentence before a
vowel then the glottal stop may be inserted, but this
is not always the case, and for English speakers (me
at least) I tend only to use a glottal stop before a
vowel if the word (and syllable) in question is
stressed.

This I think is the reason why Germans hear 'zwei'
instead of 'ein' when I say it, they're looking for
the glottal stop trigger of 'ein' which I find a bit
difficult to say in an unstressed word.

I think this might be part of the reason why a lot
English speakers find German and German accents quite
harsh. This use of the glottal stop before all words
starting with a vowel is usually carried over by
Germans when they speak English and thus gives the
impression to English ears that the speaker is
stressing lots of words.

I was wondering if this use of the glottal stop in
other Lowland dialects is more like (my) English or
like German in this respect. Any thoughts?

Gary

http://hometown.aol.com/taylor16471/myhomepage/index.html

----------

From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Phonology

Hi, Gary!

Interesting observations!  I pretty much agree (though I still can not 
imagine how anyone can hear _ein_ as _zwei_).

I would go as far as submitting that German (i.e., most of its dialect) has 
a phonemic glottal stop, in other words, that the syllable structure V(C(C)) 
does not occur, that you get only CV(C(C)).  (By the way, I found the same 
applying in Uyghur (Eastern Turkic).)  Alternatively you would have to say 
that the structure V(C(C)) is not permissible *phonetically* and that 
therefore a glottal stop must be insterted by rule.

However this may be, it is my observation that glottal stop insertion in 
Germany's indigenous languages other than German is one of the hallmarks of 
Germanization, of the "German accent" that predominates among younger native 
speakers and among non-native speakers whose first language is German. 
(Another feature is _st..._ [St] and _sp..._ [Sp] (though not in Romany and 
Sorbian), and then there is the uvular /r/.)

When I listen to older speakers of Low Saxon I notice that glottal stops are 
only inserted before /V(C(C))/ after a pause or if the word receives some 
emphasis.  However, liaison (as in English) does not usually occur.  (In 
many Eastern Yiddish dialects there is some liaison, as you can hear in my 
anniversary site recording.)

The other day I listened to a chunk of narration in Sinte (i.e., a Romany 
variety of the Sinte people, most of whom are sedentary and live among 
ethnic Germans).  I was struck by the strong "German accent."  Glottal stop 
insertion was a part of it, as was the use of uvular /r/ (which thus 
coincided with the phoneme /G/, spelled <rr>; cf. Romany /roma/ <Roma> 
["roma] 'Rome' vs /Goma/ <Rroma> ["Roma] 'Roma', 'Gypsy').

Take care, and watch that lovely figure, what with all those double portions 
of buttery croissants!

Regards,
Reinhard/Ron 

==============================END===================================
* Please submit postings to lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org.
* Postings will be displayed unedited in digest form.
* Please display only the relevant parts of quotes in your replies.
* Commands for automated functions (including "signoff lowlands-l") are
  to be sent to listserv at listserv.linguistlist.org or at
  http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html.
======================================================================