LL-L "Phonology" 2005.02.03 (05) [E/B/Icelandic]

[Lowlands-L]

======================================================================
L O W L A N D S - L * 03.FEB.2005 (05) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
http://www.lowlands-l.net * lowlands-l at lowlands-l.net
Rules & Guidelines: http://www.lowlands-l.net/index.php?page=rules
Posting: lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org or lowlands-l at lowlands-l.net
Server Manual: http://www.lsoft.com/manuals/1.8c/userindex.html
Archives: http://listserv.linguistlist.org/archives/lowlands-l.html
Encoding: Unicode (UTF-8) [Please switch your view mode to it.]
=======================================================================
You have received this because you have been subscribed upon request.
To unsubscribe, please send the command "signoff lowlands-l" as message
text from the same account to listserv at listserv.linguistlist.org or
sign off at http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html.
=======================================================================
A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West) Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
=======================================================================

From: Þjóðríkr Þjóðreksson <didimasure at hotmail.com>
Subject: LL-L "Phonology" 2005.02.02 (03) [B]


>From: Kenneth Rohde Christiansen <kenneth at gnu.org>
>Subject: LL-L "Phonology" 2005.02.02 (03) [E]
>
>Well, I would say that they are indeed long. There is also a phonemic
>difference between the words 'tal' and 'taal'. And in words like water
>you don't have a nasal nor a liquid.
>
>It is the exactly same with e. In Gronings (and in Standard Dutch) we
>have ee [e:] en [E:] (and in Dutch [EI] as well, like in weet).  The
>[E:] occours where the E used to be short! Thus in words like 'vergeten'
>(compare with German, vergissen), 'eten' (essen), 'beter' (besser, Eng.
>better). In some dialects like for instance Twents this is so apparent
>that they actually write it as 'ae' or 'ea'. But pronouncing these words
>with [e:] in Dutch would sound wrong in my ears, or maybe Belgian :)

Baai ons in België sprekte (in de Standoardtoal) inderdoad zoewel d'ouw
körte Germoanse "e" as de vrugere "ai" öt as 'n lange [e:], mor ik wist ni
dat da 'Belgisch' Nederlands was! Veur zoever as 'kik wet, spreke z'in
Nederland toch alle "e"s oit as [e.i] of zoe-iet (maain fonetisch schrift is
nimiêr wa get gewest is mor et klinkt gelak "eej")? Ik hem nog nuôit gehuôrd
dad iemand de [E:] gebrökte (of de [e:])!

In alle geval, in Antwêrpen (en volgens maai in vele gruetere diêlen van
België) is et onderscheid tussen de körte en de lange e bewoard gebleven,
net gelaaik baai de o's.

Lange ee verschaaint as [i:@], ni te verwarren med de lange ie woar ge giên
[@] achter huôrt. Mor veul dialecten hemmen hun eigen versie, ik ken mengsen
die [ji:], [je:], [e:@] en miêr van da zeggen.
In m'n eigen spellink gebroik 'k hierveur iê omda get oep ie lekt mor 't is
toch doidelek te onderscheiden wa betreft klank. De officiële Broabantse
dialectspellink gebroik 'k ni geern.
In 'ne gesloten lettergriêp klink het miêr gelak [I]

De körte e verschaaint hier oek as [E:] mor deur de verspreidink van het AN
goa dees klank rap verloren. De lange ee bleft heur eigen harder verzetten
tegen heur verdwaainen.

Baai de o is 't persies van 'tzelfste, de lange oo oit Germoans au is iet in
den oard van [u:@], [o:@] , [wo:] welk ik schraaif as uô of uo (wersjaainlek
hemmen het Oud Huôg Döts en het Ouwloagfrankis maai geïnspireerd). In 'ne
gesloten lettergriêp klink het lak [U]. Gelaaik in het woord oek = ook =
auch.

De körte o huôrde as 'n [O:] of hoe dat ge da oek schreft, nogmoals m'n
excuses veur m'n slechte fonetiek. De verlengde open o dus. Ni hetzelfste as
de oa!

Doarom vin 'kik het vreemd da get AN dees twiê klanken samengesmolten hee!

E poar decennia gelejen konste 't verschil nog doidelek zieng in de
spellink: groote en boter woar dialect [gru:@te] en [bO:t at r] hee, naa is 't
grote en boter.

[Diederik Masure]

----------

From: R. F. Hahn lowlands-l at lowlands-l.net
Subject: Phonology

Sæll og blessaður, Þjóðríkr, og welkomminn til Lowlands-Ls!  Gaman að hitta
þig.

Hafðu samband!

Reinhard "Ron" F. Hahn
Founder & Administrator, Lowlands-L
lowlands-l at lowlands-l.net
http://www.lowlands-l.net

P.S.: A posting must have the author's given and family names, even if not
next to each other, and they must be the real names.

==============================END===================================
* Please submit postings to lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org.
* Postings will be displayed unedited in digest form.
* Please display only the relevant parts of quotes in your replies.
* Commands for automated functions (including "signoff lowlands-l") are
  to be sent to listserv at listserv.linguistlist.org or at
  http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html.
=======================================================================