LL-L "Resources" 2005.06.19 (02) [D/E]

[Lowlands-L]

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L O W L A N D S - L * 19.JUN.2005 (02) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
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A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
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From: Roger Thijs, Euro-Support, Inc. <roger.thijs at euro-support.be>
Subject: vocabulary

A couple of days ago I received a new volume of the WVD:

Woordenboek der Vlaamse Dialecten
[Deel III] Algemene woordenschat
Aflevering 4: Karakter
door Tineke de Pauw en Magda Devos
2005, Vakgroep Nederlandse Taalkunde Universiteit Gent
Distribution: Drukkerij G. Michiels, Tongeren
xxxvii + 544 pp + fold-out map

It covers:
for France: Frans Vlaanderen
for Belgium: the provinces West- & Oost-Vlaanderen
for the Netherlands; Zeeuws Vlaanderen

For every word dealt with, and having some recurrency, a map shows the
distribution. It is followed by a list of singular occurencies with
specified municipality.

This message refers to just one word "durven" in the WVD (p 207-208).

It is "durven" (darven, derven, terven, turven) for most of the territory,
except for 2 pockets with "dorren" (derren, durren, terren, turren):
- one pocket with "dorren": virtually the whole of French Flanders
- another: the South East of East Flanders (river Dender area)
both areas adjacent to the Romance language area.

Are "durven" and "dorren" originally two different verbs?

We use also "dorren" in my West-Limburgish (also close to the Romance
language area):
- Vliermaal (Lonerlands) dèrre
- Schalkhoven (Tongerlands): dore

Vliermaal:
- Present: Ich dèèr
- Past: Ich djoeës
- Conditional Present: Ich djuës
("j+vowel" corresponds often with "vowel+r" in other lowlandic variants)

Is "dorren" linked to the English "dare" (semantically the same)?
and
"durven" linked to German "dürfen" (semantically different = be
allowed/permitted in German)?

As to the WNT (Woordenboek der Nederlandsche Taal) CDROM  (quote follows)
"dorren" died out in the 17th century. This clearly is not the case with
Belgian Low Germanic dialects along the Romance language border.

-- quote
DORREN (I) - DARREN -, bedr. en onz. ww., behoorende tot de zgn.
praeterito-praesentia. Mnl. dorren, mnd. dorren, derren, mhd. turren,
verouderd hd. durren, eng. dare, got. daursan. Tot de verwanten buiten het
Germaansch behooren gr. qrasúV, vermetel en skr. dhrsnoti, wagen. Het ww.
dorren is sinds de 17de eeuw geheel verdrongen door durven (dorven),
waarmede het den vorm voor den verl. tijd dorste gemeen had. Voor de vormen
zie men overigens VERDAM.
1) Verbonden met eene onbepaalde wijs of met het, als vervanger van eene
onbepaalde wijs. Den moed hebben, durven. || Wie zal hem van sonden belasten
dorren, V. D. MEULEN, Ketiuigh. 185. Dat soudic wel dorren proeven Met
disputacien, Gentsche Sp. 317. Als ghy my op dese stucken Niet vele en
antwoort, oft niet tegen en dort spreken, So sal ic het recht winnen, V.
GHISTELE, Terent. Phorm. 8. Zal ic voor Minerva wel dorren spreken van
wijsheit? D'HEERE, Boomg. d. Poes. 79. Hoe sult ghy voor Godts aenschijn
dorren blijven staen? Met een onreyne besmette conscientie? HOUWAERT, Vier
Wterste 69. De gene, die soe vele mijnre vroomer oprechter kinderen bloet
hebben dorren moordadelijc doen storten, bij FREDERICQ, Pamfl. 22. Dus ben
ick (Polyphemus) wel so stout en coen Dat ick u in spijt van Jupiter ... al
tsamen soude dorren eten, COORNHERT, Odyss. 58 a. 't Zy wat verwateling die
glans bezwalken dar! OUDAAN, Toneelp. 203.
2) Door verwarring met durven, dorven: behoeven. || Sy en dorren ooc niet
zorghen dat inder nacht Van my eenich verraet zal worden ghewracht, V.
GHISTELE, Aen. 173 b. Wy en dorren de vyanden niet verre zoecken, Sy staen
onder de mueren, 225 b. Ghi en dort niet grouwen, V. GHISTELE, Ovid.
Sendtbr. 87.
-- end quote

Regards,
Roger

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