LL-L "Etymology" 2005.06.26 (11) [A/D/E/LS]

[Lowlands-L]

======================================================================
L O W L A N D S - L * 26.JUN.2005 (11) * ISSN 189-5582 * LCSN 96-4226
http://www.lowlands-l.net * lowlands-l at lowlands-l.net
Rules & Guidelines: http://www.lowlands-l.net/index.php?page=rules
Posting: lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org or lowlands-l at lowlands-l.net
Commands ("signoff lowlands-l" etc.): listserv at listserv.net
Server Manual: http://www.lsoft.com/manuals/1.8c/userindex.html
Archives: http://listserv.linguistlist.org/archives/lowlands-l.html
Encoding: Unicode (UTF-8) [Please switch your view mode to it.]
=======================================================================
You have received this because you have been subscribed upon request.
To unsubscribe, please send the command "signoff lowlands-l" as message
text from the same account to listserv at listserv.linguistlist.org or
sign off at http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html.
=======================================================================
A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West)Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeêuws)
=======================================================================

From: Luc Hellinckx <luc.hellinckx at pandora.be>
Subject: Etymology

Beste Elsie,

Je schreef:

> Buttje het sy aanklank in Afrikaans met "boetie" wat broer of seuntjie
> beteken.
> Ek noem my drie broers 'Boeta' as liefdeswoordjie.
>
> Die woord het in Xhosa/Zoeloe 'buthie' geword, en wat ons nuwe
> onder-eerste
> minister, Phumzile Mahlampo-Ngquka die hoofregter gedurende die week
> genoem
> het (buite protokol!) toe hy haar ingesweer het.

Zou "boetie" hier iets te maken hebben met dat fantastisch Zuidafrikaans
gerecht, dat we hier "boeboetie" noemen (reduplication?)? "Jongens"
toch, ben ik echt gek op!

Vriendelijke groeten,

Luc Hellinckx

---------

From: jonny <jonny.meibohm at arcor.de>
Subject: Etymology

(English below)

Leyve Reynhard, Lowlanners,

R. hett mi güstern 'n Mail schickt, in de hei dat Woord LS: _stilkens_ . G:
'unbemerkt', 'heimlich', E: 'stealthy' bruuken deei. Is ouk hier bruuklich
un' bekannt. Man- ick hevv 't sülvst ne kennt! Mookt 'n jo ne.

Kunn dat woll verwandt ween an  Hebr./Jiddish 'stiekum', in de sülvigt
Meen'n??

***

Dear Ronny, Lowlanders,

yesterday I got a mail from R. being used the word LS: _stilkens_, G:
'unbemerkt', 'heimlich', E: 'stealthy' within. A word still in use here, in
our region, though I didn't know it myself (without being ashamed).

Could it be related to Hebr./Jiddish 'stiekum', standing for the same
meaning??

***

To all:

Greutens/Regards

Johannes "Jonny" Meibohm

----------

From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Etymology

Jonny,

[English below]

> Kunn dat woll verwandt ween an  Hebr./Jiddish 'stiekum', in de sülvigt
> Meen'n??

So eyn wourd ken ik nich in 't Jiddische, touminst nich in't Oost-Jiddische. 
Ik neem an, dat is West-Jiddisch.  "Stiekum" or "stiekem" wardt in 't 
Duytsche un Nedderlandsche bruukt un schal uut 't Rotwelsche or 
"Barguunsche" (_Bargoens_) kamen, un dat het 't vun (West-)Jiddische 
*_stike_, wat vun 't Hebreesche *סודיק _sowdiyk_ 'heymlichkayt' af-kamen is. 
In 't Oost-Jiddische segt 'n vör "stilkens", "stil swygens" or "heymlich" 
בסודיק _besodik_, un dat keym vun Hebreesch בסודיק _b'sowdiyk_ "in 
heymlichkayt".  (Dat Hebreesche grundwourd is סוד _sowd_ 'geheymnis'.)

Vun "stilkens" neem ik an, dat 't 'n Nedderlandsch leenwourd is.  Dat 
Nedderlandsche het dimunityw-formen vun adjektiewen un adverbia, so ook 
_soetje_ (uutspraak _suutje_).  _Stilkens_ is ook so eyn ding, un den het 
dat ook noch dat adverbial-s (as in "'s avendS", "nachtenS").

> Could it be related to Hebr./Jiddish 'stiekum', standing for the same
> meaning??

I don't know such a Yiddish word, at least not an Eastern Yiddish one.  I 
assume it is Western Yiddish.  _Stiekum_ or _stiekem_ is used in German and 
Dutch and is supposed to have come from Rotwelsch or Bargoens, which got it 
from (Western) Yiddish *_stike_, derived from Hebrew *סודיק _sowdiyk_ 
'secrecy'.  The Eastern Yiddish for 'secretly', 'clandestinely', 
'stealthily', 'on the quiet', etc. is בסודיק _besodik_, from Hebrew בסודיק 
_b'sowdiyk_ "in secrecy." (The Hebrew base word is סוד _sowd_ 'secret'.)

I assume that _stilkens_ is a Dutch loanword.  Dutch has diminutiv forms of 
adjectives and adverbs, such as the recently discussed _soetje_.  _Stilkens_ 
is another case, with the base form _stil_ ("still", "quiet") and the 
addition of adverbial -s (as in LS _'s avends_ 'in the evening', _nachtens_ 
'by night').

Kumpelmenten/Regards,
Reinhard/Ron

==============================END===================================
Please submit postings to lowlands-l at listserv.linguistlist.org.
Postings will be displayed unedited in digest form.
Please display only the relevant parts of quotes in your replies.
Commands for automated functions (including "signoff lowlands-l")
are  to be sent to listserv at listserv.linguistlist.org or at
http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html.
=======================================================================