LL-L "History" 2005.10.10 (01) [E]
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L O W L A N D S - L * 10 October 2005 * Volume 01
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From: Thomas Byro <greenherring at gmail.com>
Subject: LL-L "History" 2005.10.07 (01) [E]
Ron
Somewhere I have a book I bought from the History bookclub entitled The
Anglo-Saxons. The book convincingly documented that a huge reverse
migration took place after he Britons nearly expelled the Saxons, confining
them to the island of Tanith. These people recolonized Holstein and other
Saxon areas including Hamburg, which had become a slavic trading post.
Tom Byro
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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: History
Thanks, Tom!
Interesting! I hadn't heard that one before.
I have heard, however, that already very early on English Saxon Christian
missionaries went back to their ancestors' (perhaps even parents' or
grandparents') homeland to convert folks there, and that they probably had
few, if any, communication problems, even though their language varieties
were somewhat different.
I didn't know that Hamburg had become a Slavonic trading post, though I did
know that there were Slavs living just east and that Slavs attacked and
largely destroyed the Hamma Castle (_Hammaburg_) in 1066, and again in 1072,
supposedly ending in horrific bloodbaths.
The "heathen walls" (like the ones that are now the downtown streets
Mönckebergstraße, Großer Wall and Kleiner Wall) were no match for the
attackers. The then new, first cathedral built from stone (in 1032) under
Archbishop Bezelin (Allebrand, 1035-1045) was destroyed. Apparently, some
folks at the castle had had it coming, because Christian Saxons had been
grossly oppressing the mostly non-Christian Obodrite Slavs that lived just a
very short distance east of the fortress, areas of which some are now
eastern suburbs of Hamburg. Much of the chicanery -- mostly in the form of
unreasonable taxes and horrific punishments -- had been committed through
Christianized Slavonic aristocrats as middleman puppets, especially by
baptized Henry I (1093-1127) and Gottschalk (1044-1066). The non-Christian
Slavonic duke Plusso (~ Blusson, 1066-1067) was the leader of the first
revolt. Gottschalk and his personal priest Ippo were killed. John, the
zealous Scottish missionary and bishop of Mecklenburg (then the Obodrite
center), was first abducted and then killed at Ratzeburg Lake (still a place
of pilgrimage in Holstein these days!). Monks were stoned. Farther east in
Mecklenburg, Henry's wife, a Danish princess, and her ladies in waiting were
beaten, stripped naked and chased away, and Henry himself finds refuge among
his relatives in Denmark. ... And apparently more "fun" was being had by
everyone ...
The degree of destruction has been reported as having even altered the
landscape, and numerous Saxons were taken back east as slaves. As a result,
the number of Christians in Northern Albingia (the Saxon domain north of the
Elbe river) had been decimated to the point that for 84 years no bishop was
appointed to the seat at Oldenburg, the then center of Roman Catholic power
for the entire area. At the end of that, the Saxons, boosted by brethren
from other regions, hit back and killed Plusso. This only served to
increase anti-Christian sentiments among the Slavs. When the wife of
Baruth, Plusso's successor, gave birth to a "revolting creature, two-headed,
donkey-eared and bear-clawed" just before Christmas, Baruth convinced
everyone that this was due to Christian witchcraft. Under his leadership --
though according to some sources under the leadership of a certain Kruto,
son of Grin, -- Slavonic insurgents assassinated any Christian they could
find, and this escalated into a very violent revolt ... "until the streets
were rivers of blood." However, not all Slavs participated, and others took
sides with the Christianized Slavs, like the largely Christianized Bards and
Holsts (after whom Bardowik and Holstein were named) who had given shelter
to Budivoj, Henry's son, who was later killed at the Slavonic fortress of
Plune (> Plön) in Holstein when local women accused him and his men of rape.
This was not the first time Hamburg was attacked. As the northernmost power
base of Christianized Saxons under Frankish power, ruled by Bishop Ansgar
from his wooden cathedral built in 831/832, and as a trading center to lure
in "heathens," it had been a sitting duck since the very beginning --
virtually at the tip of a wedge driven into the "heathen" world: "Vikings"
to the north and Slavs to the east. In 845, when it was quite new, it had
been attacked and plundered by "Vikings" (most likely a confederation of
Danes and Jutes, possibly also some Angles). Bishop Ansgar (~ Anskar ~
Oskar, 801-865), Norman-French by birth (Amien), now seen as the bringer of
Christianity to Scandinavia, fled from Hamburg and in 845 was appointed to
lead the Bremen diocese from a safe distance in the west. The Hamburg
diocese remained without a bishop for quite some time, had been a failure at
the edge of the "heathen" world, for a while existed in name only and was
eventually merged into the Bremen diocese. It had descended to the actual
status of a trading post (_wîk_), and by the time it had crawled out of this
depth about two centuries later, thanks to returning and immigrating Saxons,
it was destroyed twice by nearby Slavs. Again it had set itself up by
allowing itself to be used as a political, expansionist Christian speahead,
a staging post for Christianization by injustice, and that not very long
after the pre-Christian Saxons had suffered the same sort of fate under
Charlemagne (742~747-814).
Doesn't all of this also remind you of the way the American West was won ~
lost several centuries later?
Yep, thaym w'r th' dayas ...
Regards,
Reinhard/Ron
----------
From: burgdal32admin <burgdal32 at pandora.be>
Subject: LL-L "History" 2005.10.09 (01) [E]
Look at this website also!
http://www.brucop.com/millennium/nederlands/toponyms/
(You can change the language at the homepage)
Groetjes,
Luc Vanbrabant
Oekene
From: jonny <jonny.meibohm at arcor.de>
Subject: LL-L "History" 2005.10.08 (04) [E]
Hi, Ingmar,
Then the Wursten county should be considered as a part of East Frisia
rather than North Frisia, or even seperately?
It's separately, though closer to East- than to North-Frisia. I even don't
know wether it is still specially represented in the 'Friesenrat' today.
They're pretty aware to be Frisians partly, but of course during the long
times they got mixed up with the sorrounding (Saxon) folks. Their LS is
much
closer to the Bremen-variety than to any EFLS-one.
The first mentioning of
Frisians in the Land of Wursten is 1071 by Von Lehe, I read in the link
Reinhard sent two days ago about the history of the Germanic people(s)
in Northern Germany.
I've read this interesting book from v. Lehe (he had been a judge),
investigated in our times and edited in A.D. 1978. I think he writes about
1071 as the first documentary mentioning of a special village. I slightly
remember (just a penny worth) it was any contract with the city of Hamburg
resp. the Duke of Lauenburg; they always had special relations to Wursten
because of the safety regarding ships coming up the Elbe river. The same
was
with the city of Bremen and the Weser river.
(BTW: the competition between these big Hanse-cities the 'Wurtfriesen'
always used for their own advantage and that gave them a special rank
throughout the centuries.)
Modern archaeological researches prove Frisian tracks (e.g. in graves) for
the 8. century there.
The first mentioning of Frisians in East Frisia was not
so much earlier.
But they must have been in the region much earlier, because historicans
guess the first dikes already built there in the 11. century. It's not
proved, but in our region, too, we date the first probable community-dikes
into the same times.
But certainly there must have been settlements long before, and I don't
believe that the Saxons would have left a region they had cultivated
because
of any Frisian pressure.
That could have happened much later, in the dark times of the chaos
amongst
the East-Frisian clans and chieftains. They then were famous for their
quarrels amongst each other and were feared as pirates by the Hanse. I
read
about any axis Groningen-Bremen-Hamburg specially founded against these
robberish people.
Sorry for my endurance in this topic- but we're talking about a region
nearly in front of my house-door.
Greutens/Regards
Johannes "Jonny" Meibohm
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