LL-L "Traditions" 2005.09.04 (05) [E/LS]

Sun Sep 4 21:33:23 UTC 2005

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From:  jonny <jonny.meibohm at arcor.de>
Subject: LL-L "Traditions" 2005.09.03 (01) [E]

Heather, Ron,

> Heather (above):
>
> > Is this also the name given to the open window in the Boden that most
> > large
> > old houses have - so that the draught can dry clothes hung up to dry up
> > there?
>
> Hmmm ... I'm not totally sure, but I doubt it.  (Do you know, Jonny, or
> someone else?)
No, sorry. I'm just aware of that mentioned smoke hole.

But, Heather, in any previous mail you wrote:
> Woden - powerless in England, so the word
> Wednesday was allowed to be used: so powerful in Germany that  Wodenstag
> had to be replaced by Mittwoch. etc
But- why keeping 'Donnerstag' = 'Donar's/Thor's day' = 'Thursday' in German?
I don't think him having been less powerful than 'Wodan' in Old Germanic
mythologies.

Kind regards

Johannes "Jonny" Meibohm

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From:  jonny <jonny.meibohm at arcor.de>
Subject: LL-L "Traditions" 2005.09.03 (08) [E/German]

Theo, Reinhard,
(English below)

Theo schreev:
> Concerning the gable-swans:  In the Netherlands [and
> you were talking about a Dutch settlement] the
> Lutherans used to use a swan to indicate they were a
> Lutheran and not a Calvinist.

Reinhard:
> In brief, the legend goes that, when he was about to be burnt at the stake
> as a heretic in Constance (Southern Germany), the Czech Protestant Jan Hus
> (1369-1415) said, "I might only be a poor goose [Czech _husa_], but I will
> be followed by a swan that you will not be able to roast."  At later
> times,
> this came to be seen as a premonition of Martin Luther's campaign.

Dat is föör mi heel interessant! Dank jou beid.
Dat wiest dor ophenn, dat de gröttste Deel van de Hollan'schen Seedlers in
't Oule Land eerst no de Reformatschion komen is. Man- tou de Tied van
Baldwin I., Archbischopp van Bremen (1168-1178) un Groof van Holland, sünd
ouk all welk komen (un in de neichsten ca. 150 Joorn keemen noch mehr van
jem); de hevvt sick wat dichter hier bie mien Heimatrebeed dool loten.
.....

English summary:

Very interesting! Thanks!
That shows that the greater part of Dutch settlers in the region 'Altes
Land' came after the reformation. Though- already in the times of  Baldwin
I., Archbishop of Bremen (1168-1178) and Earl of Holland, some of them came
(and more followed in the next ca. 150 years); they settled more northernly,
closer to my home region.

Greutens/Regards

Johannes "Jonny" Meibohm

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From:  heather rendall <HeatherRendall at compuserve.com>
Subject: LL-L "Traditions" 2005.09.03 (01) [E]

Message text written by INTERNET:lowlands-l at LOWLANDS-L.NET
> If you can possible arrange it, I recommend visiting  the Lunenburg
Heath<

But I know it already having spent two delicious holidays up there at a
friend's house  in a tiny village called Trebel whilst at university in
Göttingen.

I spent many days riding through the forest to the sound of bees, the scent
of pine needles and the drone of dratted horseflies - who always smelled me
coming a mile off and attacked in numbers!

I ate rump of venison and potatoes and the most delicious gravy ever - my
friend's late father had been a forester and his widow still received his
'cut' from deer.

I helped Omi pickle gerkins with herbs we had picked from the hedgerows and
tried to learn Platt from her.

And every evening I drove the cows back home for milking barefoot along the
sandy paths.

It remains a blissful memory.

Heather

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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Traditions

Jonny, ja, "Hollanders" un ook "Vlamen" keymen pö-a-pö oever jaar-hunnerden 
(eywen), an-vungen up 't laatste üm de eyrste jaar-dusend-wend, ünner 't 
motto "Nâ ôstland wil ik vâren", un daar meynen sey, de Sassen un de 
Duytschen tou meyrst de Slaawschen rebeyden mit.  Sey noemen use dialekten 
_Oostersch_."

Jonny, yes, "Dutch" and also "Flemish" people arrived in Northern Germany 
over the span of centuries, starting at the latest with the turn of the 
first millennium, under the motto _Nâ ôstland wil ik vâren_ ("To the east is 
where I'll travel"), by which they, like Saxons and Germans, tended to refer 
to the Slavonic areas.  For them, Low Saxon of Northern Germany was 
_Oostersch_ ("Eastern (speech)."

Heather (above):

> It remains a blissful memory.

I can relate to that.  It sounds wonderful.  Perhaps you'll be able to go 
back sometime -- although you can't *really* go back (and I'm sure you know 
what I mean.)  Next time you might be able to see the Northern Heath, which 
is quite lovely too.  Also, we'll all be able to take in some Heath action 
in combination with Gabriele's house-warming party (at which time we'll take 
a good look at her _Ulenfluh_), although I assume her new old estate is just 
south of the Heath, technically speaking.

Oh, and I hope the occupying British Royal Army has meanwhile stopped doing 
to the Heath what in Tok Pisin is called _bagarapim_.

Kumpelmenten,
Reinhard/Ron

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