LL-L "Etymology" 2006.03.01 (08) [E]

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A=Afrikaans Ap=Appalachian B=Brabantish D=Dutch E=English F=Frisian
L=Limburgish LS=Lowlands Saxon (Low German) N=Northumbrian
S=Scots Sh=Shetlandic V=(West) Flemish Z=Zeelandic (Zeeuws)
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01 March 2006 * Volume 08
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From: Clarkedavid8 at aol.com <Clarkedavid8 at aol.com>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2006.03.01 (02) [D/E/V]

Ronald Desnerck writes:


  "What's the etymology of this _schots_?

  I think nobody really knows for sure. "Schots" always connotes negativity,
  for example:

  "Da laa dàà allegàà _schots_ en schiëf" (also: "'t Laa dàà 
schedderwedder",
  or
  "'t Laa dàà allegàà overénne") = the place was a complete shambles

  One can also say:

  "A èè ma dàà nogal schots g'antwood" (B)

  when a person replied in an unfriendly and scornful way. Middle Low
  German knew that word "schutsch" (= stupid, rude, boorish) too"

  Could "Schots" therefore also be related to the English word "Scot" or 
"Scottish"?

  David Clarke
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From: R. F. Hahn <sassisch at yahoo.com>
Subject: Etymology

Hi, Dave!

> Could "Schots" therefore also be related to the English word "Scot" or 
> "Scottish"?

That's what I wondered in a previous posting too.  I hadn't thought about 
Middle Saxon _schutsch_ though.  Interesting!  Would that indicate that 
earlier Continental Lowlanders stereotyped Scots as "trashy" or "messy"? 
;-)  Might this rumor have been started by disgruntled Flemish textile 
workers that were sent home because they couldn't cut it in Scotland?

In today's Low-Saxon-speaking Northern Germany there are only two references 
to "Scottish" (_schotsch_ <schottsch>) both of them positive:

Schottsch (a type of dance)
schottsche Karr ("Scottish cart," a flatbed cart with two large wheels,
     typically used by old-time market vendors)

But "British," well, that's another matter ... In Hamburg Low Saxon and 
Missingsch, a _Bri(e)t_ (pl. _Brie(t)en_) is an antisocial element, a 
ruffian or hooligan ... ;-)  There's even an old popular song called _Die 
Barmbeker Briten_ and a new comedy with that title performed by the 
Ohnsorg-Theater, Hamburg.  There must have been negative stereotypes of 
Brits and of people of Barmbek (try and pronounce it as in Australian 
English to get the Hamburg sound), a neighborhood that is now a part of 
Hamburg.  However, these stories are funny, and those _Briten_ come off less 
like hardened criminals than like "naughty" folk of the street-smart type, 
but there are old reports about a burgler guild that bore the name with 
pride.

Cheers!
Reinhard/Ron 

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